Sinead O'Connor: 'There should be a full criminal investigation of the pope'

[Ognir]

I remember the photo of the pope thing  :crazy:  

In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.
- Notebook, 1904

http://www.twainquotes.com/Patriotism.html

Reporting from Bray, Ireland - She shot to fame 20 years ago with her shaved head, chiseled cheeks and haunting rendition of the song "Nothing Compares 2 U." Then she gained notoriety when she tore up a photo of Pope John Paul II on American TV, calling him "the enemy" and urging people to fight child abuse.

Sinead O'Connor is still singing. And she's still speaking out against abuse -- only now her 1992 stunt on "Saturday Night Live" almost seems prescient as the Roman Catholic Church faces a growing catalog of complaints about child sexual and physical assault by priests in her Irish homeland and across Europe.

Such mistreatment was rampant here in Ireland, going back decades. By 1987, the Irish church was alarmed enough that it took out an insurance policy against future lawsuits and claims for compensation stemming from sexual-abuse allegations.

This past weekend, Pope Benedict XVI issued a "pastoral letter" apologizing to the flock in Ireland for the church's past failures. He did not outline any disciplinary action against the bishops who many here say covered up priestly misdeeds, though on Wednesday he accepted the resignation of Bishop John Magee, who had been accused of failing to report suspected pedophile priests to police. The pope also pinned no blame on the Vatican itself for a culture of secrecy that critics say it deliberately fostered.

O'Connor, now 43 and a mother of four, spoke to The Times on Tuesday at her seaside home in Bray, south of Dublin, about the abuse scandal.

Do you feel the pope's letter was enough?

It's a study in the fine art of lying and actually betraying your own people. . . . He starts by saying that he's writing with great concern for the people of Ireland. If he was that concerned, why has it taken him 23 years to write a letter, and why did he or the last pope never get on an airplane and come to meet the victims in any of these countries and apologize?

The letter sells the Irish [church] hierarchy downriver by stating again and again that the Irish hierarchy has somehow acted independently of the Vatican. . . . The documents are there to prove that that's a lie. . . .

If you were the boss of a company and some of the employees of your company were known to sexually abuse children, you would fire them instantly. You would also go instantly to meet the people who had been abused and profusely apologize and offer your help in any way whatsoever to deal with this. . . . That has never happened.

As a cardinal, the pope wrote an order in 2001 demanding that abuse cases be dealt with in secret. But doesn't the directive also mention cooperating with civil authorities?

That document stated that all matters of abuse were to be sent to him in Rome, where he would decide whether they would be dealt with by Rome or locally by the bishops. They were to be dealt with exclusively by the church, and they were subject to pontifical secret, which means you can be excommunicated if you breach the secret. . . .

[It's true that] it's the first time ever that any document coming from the Vatican actually does say to the clergy that they should cooperate with civil authorities. . . . What I object to here is, the first time they said that was 2001. They knew back in 1987 at least that this was an issue. . . . They knew so much that they took out an insurance policy.

So what should the pope do?

There should be a full criminal investigation of the Catholic hierarchy of any country in which this has been an issue. There should be a full criminal investigation of the Vatican.

There should be a full criminal investigation of the pope. The pope should stand down for the fact that he did not act in a Christian fashion to protect children, and for the fact that his organization acted to preserve their business interests decade after decade rather than be concerned about the interests of children, and for showing so much disrespect for Christ, God, the victims, the rest of us, their own clergy. . . .

The Vatican and the pope need to get on their knees and confess the full truth in the same language they make us use in Mass. . . . They need to get on their knees, open everything up, be transparent, tell the truth, ask the people for forgiveness and prayers.

That confession is their only hope of survival into the 21st century. It's a rickety bridge, but it is a bridge. And personally, I would be willing to bring them across that little bridge into the 21st century and help them. . . .

If they don't do that, they will not survive. . . . I hope they do survive, because there's a lot that's really beautiful about Catholicism. Even though there are those of us who are fighting it like you would fight an abusive parent, you love the parent still and you want it to be healed.

What about the abuse victims?

He [the pope] says his concern is "to bring healing to the victims." But he's denying them the one thing which might actually bring them healing, which is a full confession from the Vatican. . . .

You're talking about some very broken people. . . . Life is very difficult for them. They can't hold down jobs, can't hold down relationships. . . . Life is difficult. Therapy costs a lot of money. These people don't make much money; hardly any of them are actually fit to work. They need the Vatican to cough up some of its billions [to] pay for these people to be able to live their lives.

Should Irish bishops resign, as a few have offered?

Resignation gets them off the hook. They should be criminally prosecuted. . . . If you or I covered up crimes like that, we'd be slap-bang in jail in five minutes, and rightly so. There's a double standard. . . .

What should the Irish people do?

It's the good-hearted, sweet Catholic people who go to Mass still despite all of this -- they are the people who have the power in their hands to get the Vatican on its knees and confess. . . . How these people can do that is by refusing to go to Mass, boycott them until they actually come to their knees and confess. . . .

The way we are at the moment, we're in a very dysfunctional relationship with an organization that's actually abusing us. And we can't see what's being done to us. We have the mentality of a battered wife who thinks it's her fault. If we had a friend in a similar relationship, we would beg him or her to walk away.

Yet you still consider yourself a Catholic?

I'm a Catholic, and I love God. . . . That's why I object to what these people are doing to the religion that I was born into. . . .

I'm passionately in love and always have been with what I call the Holy Spirit, which I believe the Catholic Church have held hostage and still do hold hostage. I think God needs to be rescued from them. They are not representing Christian values and Christian attitudes. If they were truly Christian, they would've confessed ages ago, and we wouldn't be having to batter the door down and try to get blood from a stone.

mailto:henry.chu@latimes.com">henry.chu@latimes.com

[Christopher Marlowe]

I pointed out in an earlier post that the 1917 Code of Canon Law was very explicit about defrocking and punishing clergy who were guilty of this abuse. That was changed to a more watered down law.  Why?

The 1917 code of canon law- Canon 2359, paragraph 2 states: "If they (clerics) have committed an offense
against the sixth commandment with minors under sixteen years of age, or been guilty of adultery, rape, bestiality,
sodomy, traffic in vice, or incest with blood-relatives or relations by marriage in the first degree, they shall be suspended, declared infamous, deprived of every office, benefice dignity, or position that they may hold, and in more grievous cases they shall be deposed."
The Second Vatican Council however, repealed this law with the 1983 Code of Canon Law, which states in
Canon 1395, paragraph 2: "A cleric who has offended in other ways against the sixth commandment of the Decalogue, if the crime was committed by force, or by threats, or in public, or with a minor under the age of sixteen years, is to be punished with just penalties (?), not excluding dismissal from the clerical state if the case so warrants."
This watered-down Canon from the revised 1983 code of Canon Law was a major step toward neutralizing
God's law regarding sodomy. It also gave homosexual bishops the ability to retain child abusing clergy as well as
sodomite bishops and priests without directly violating canon law.

Under the common law, the employer can be held responsible for negligence or other acts of an employee who is acting within the scope of his duty. There can also be liability for negligent hiring. i.e. hiring a priest who is a known pederast. But for intentional acts outside the scope of duty, there is no liability. Therefore, the Church only incurred liability by failing to take proper action after notice, or by covering up the sexual abuse. This is an important point because any attorney would recognize that, since covering up the crime is the only way to create liability, that would definitely be the wrong course of action. What motivation would there be to cover up these crimes, or to hire priests who were homosexual pederasts?

The fact that the Church took these actions (changed policy, promoted homosexuality, covered up offenses) that directly led the sexual abuse of thousands, the worst publicity scandal in Church history, and the loss of BILLIONS of dollars makes me believe that this policy was not implemented by accident but was devised to bring the Church down. I believe there are many satanists or what-have-you in the Vatican who are deliberately working against the Catholic Church.

[mgt23]

The fact that the Church took these actions (changed policy, promoted homosexuality, covered up offenses) that directly led the sexual abuse of thousands, the worst publicity scandal in Church history, and the loss of BILLIONS of dollars makes me believe that this policy was not implemented by accident but was devised to bring the Church down. I believe there are many satanists or what-have-you in the Vatican who are deliberately working against the Catholic Church.

i agree

[Tomas O'Crohan]

I remember the photo of the pope thing  :crazy:  

You used the wrong icon Ognir. You should have used this one:  :up:

I've maintained for years that instead of suffering the immense abuse she sustained, Sinead should have been awarded the fucking Congressional Medal of Honor. She's my hero for calling out these criminals. Instead of having her prescience recognized, she received nothing but abuse from the willfully ignorant and willfully clueless.

I agree with the other commentators that this has been done by design. An uncorrupted Vatican would have brought this unmitigated evil to an end long ago. Instead, it was allowed to give itself all the rope it needed.

The one consolation is that Sinead is finally being recognized for the valiant warrior she is. All hail Sinead.

[Christopher Marlowe]

Why was Sinead O'Connor wearing a star of david when she tore up the picture of the pope?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o

I remember that incident and not understanding what she was talking about. I don't know if choosing symbols over talking is always a better choice, especially if the message is unclear.

[Ognir]

Well spotted CM

[Shiksa Rage]

I remember the photo of the pope thing  :crazy:  

You used the wrong icon Ognir. You should have used this one:  :up:

I've maintained for years that instead of suffering the immense abuse she sustained, Sinead should have been awarded the fucking Congressional Medal of Honor. She's my hero for calling out these criminals. Instead of having her prescience recognized, she received nothing but abuse from the willfully ignorant and willfully clueless.

I agree with the other commentators that this has been done by design. An uncorrupted Vatican would have brought this unmitigated evil to an end long ago. Instead, it was allowed to give itself all the rope it needed.

The one consolation is that Sinead is finally being recognized for the valiant warrior she is. All hail Sinead.

Fine as far as it goes, but she doesn't go far enough. Maybe I've missed something but I can't recall Sinead O'Connor calling out any Zionist criminals and nor will she; they control the music industry like they control everything else.

[Tomas O'Crohan]

Why was Sinead O'Connor wearing a star of david when she tore up the picture of the pope?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o

I remember that incident and not understanding what she was talking about. I don't know if choosing symbols over talking is always a better choice, especially if the message is unclear.

WTF. I never noticed that before and wouldn't have still if you hadn't pointed it out. My eyes are stuck on the face. All I keep thinking is "Et tu, Brute?" Am I to have no heroes left?

[GordZilla]

Why was Sinead O'Connor wearing a star of david when she tore up the picture of the pope?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o

I remember that incident and not understanding what she was talking about. I don't know if choosing symbols over talking is always a better choice, especially if the message is unclear.

WTF. I never noticed that before and wouldn't have still if you hadn't pointed it out. My eyes are stuck on the face. All I keep thinking is "Et tu, Brute?" Am I to have no heroes left?

Well she has long since used the Star of David, I believe it was also plastered on one of her CD's. However I think she uses the Protestant version, doesn't look any different but often the Protestant religion uses the same star. As far as 'no heroes left', well get used to losing them. A good rule to go by; If they are on  main stream media, music etc, they probably should not be considered a hero of yours  


"All my heroes are dead, they've died in my head" - Slipknot

[MikeWB]

Doesn't Sinead know that blasphemy is a punishable law in Ireland? :lol:

[Tomas O'Crohan]

My comment was TIC (tongue-in-cheek). But I do love Sinead. I was with her in the beginning and I'll be with her in the end provided she doesn't go zionist on me, which I doubt she will. She has a conscience. How aware is she? Now that's another matter. Being adorned with such a symbol at that time (I'm not sure how many years ago it was) shows she did, or perhaps still does, have a way to go yet. If you see her live, she'll put you in a trance like a Great White whose snout is squeezed. My heroes are truth tellers and the Volunteers of Óglaigh na hÉireann and the Volunteers in other countries that go by different names who have put their lives on the line and who will put their lives on the line in opposing evil. Those are my heroes. The only time I'm let down is when I find out MI5 has turned one of them.

Listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt8p5AxJn18 (Sinéad O'Connor - Mna na h Eireann) (Women of Ireland)

DBS should add this to his "Beauty in Our World" series.

[MikeWB]

Slightly off topic... could someone please explain to me these types of Irish names:

"Óglaigh na hÉireann" and also "Ó hIfearnáin"

I've seen this "Ó" few times before and also this part "hÉ". What dod they mean and why is that 'h' lowercase? Also what does "na" mean? Is that Ó like in O'Sullivan?

[scorpio]

This is all fine and dandy.
What I find most significant is the media's silence concerning several Rabbis that were caught buggering little boys recently.
I heard one brief mention of it on the news and then it 'mysteriously' disappeared.
This really shows how a story can become a sensation or nothing, depending on what best suits the ziotribe.

[Tomas O'Crohan]

This is all fine and dandy.
What I find most significant is the media's silence concerning several Rabbis that were caught buggering little boys recently.
I heard one brief mention of it on the news and then it 'mysteriously' disappeared.
This really shows how a story can become a sensation or nothing, depending on what best suits the ziotribe.

Scorpio, you've already answered your own observation on the thread entitled "Bus gets a Gentile Push." Let me quote your comment there: "Wow, there really are two sets of rules."

Yep, that be true. Try going in a courtroom with a self-chosen on the bench, a self-chosen in the dock for being caught in a scam and who in turn is represented by another self-chosen. Here's your daily pop quiz: "Under the above circumstances, how many sets of rules are present in the courtroom?"

Yep, your answer is correct. You have won today's pop quiz.

Since you're on a roll, let's give you another one: "What's the difference between a rabbi who molests innocent, defenseless children and a Catholic priest who does the same?


Yep, right again, the difference is who owns the media that report such things. The self-chosen group has us in a near media lock. That's why we communicate with each other on a forum owned by an Irish Catholic exile living in Switzerland. So we wily gentiles have found a way around the media block, at least for now.

[scorpio]

Yep, that be true. Try going in a courtroom with a self-chosen on the bench, a self-chosen in the dock for being caught in a scam and who in turn is represented by another self-chosen. Here's your daily pop quiz: "Under the above circumstances, how many sets of rules are present in the courtroom?"

self chosen.....that's great.  
I am going to start using that one  :up:

[Anonymous]

as predicted

http://www.goroadachi.com/etemenanki/up ... htm#032610

[Anonymous]

Why was Sinead O'Connor wearing a star of david when she tore up the picture of the pope?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o

I remember that incident and not understanding what she was talking about. I don't know if choosing symbols over talking is always a better choice, especially if the message is unclear.

cause the saturn worshipers are out to destroy the sun worshipers?