TiU Radio 17th May - LaV "Fight the Power"

[Ognir]

LaV starts out complimenting HHQ and og on the TiU Network,  a partnership 50-50 between myself & hhq

Thanks LaV



TiU Radio
http://www.infounderground.com
Host LatinAmericanView
Recorded 17th May 2008

LaV's second show

I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen.

This show primarily deals with the concept of power.

It asks the most basic questions: What is power? Why is power desirable? How can power be utilized to further an agenda?

These questions are thought provoking but the responses to these question can cause a paradigm shift.

Here is a quote from my show: Kurtz: I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror.

Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies. I remember when I was with Special Forces. Seems a thousand centuries ago. We went into a camp to inoculate the children.

We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for Polio, and this old man came running after us and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God... the genius of that. The genius. The will to do that. Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we.

Because they could stand that these were not monsters. These were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment. Because it's judgment that defeats us.

[hireality]

Good stuff. Where can I find LaV's first show please ?

[blueocean]

Too Bad LAV basically sprouts a view about Buddhism/Buddha that is basically the corrupted version.
( like saying: the message of Jesus is the same as what the pope says
, for the pope's message is jesus's message)

If he did real research into the real ancient Buddhist texts (from way before the destruction of the large buddhist libraries) he would come to know that the original ancient texts say something ENTIRELY different than the current corrupted Nihilistic (also zionistic) version of buddhism, that is so ideal for enslavement.


for research go to: http://www.attan.com/

[joeblow]

I'm being very careful writing this, I absolutely do not want to offend you, but if one takes what he said at face value that it was like a new form of Hinduism that could better control the people and suppress any possible revolts against the rulers, then how was it any different than the Hinduism from which it came? The concept of being eternally trapped in a certain class (better translation profession) is not very inlightened (yes, I know that's the same as illuminated. That was directed toward the other readers, not you blueocean).

[blueocean]

My understanding of Buddha, from the most ancient texts that say stuff that contradicts almost all current buddhist teachings by 180 degrees and is also being denied and misrepresented by current 'buddhists', is that of a 'dude' searching for truth and freedom.

When he finds truth he shares it with a small group, after that the reall battle begins for then the corruption and power struggle begins to f up and twist the message, assimilate it into the empire and to use it for power and enslavement.

and the hierarchy  begins..............again. :headbang:

[hireality]

Be calm friend.
Truth comes from the inside of your soul.

[LatinAmericanview]

Thank you all for you comments. I will do a show just on reader feedback. I truly love the interplay, this will allow me to defend my position.

[blueocean]

Be calm friend

Remaining calm does make me look bettter (antidote for delphi technique   )


The beauty of this forum is that I can say: Fuck Delphi!    

using fox/cnn mainstream representations of a certain group or truth or postion or event or anything  to then attack it based upon that misrepresentation is something I will point out.

Is most of current (and hindu caste system empire times and tibetan godruler hierarchy times) buddhism and buddhist teachings fucked up and actually a tool of enslavement?  Hell yes!


Did it originally start out that way?   No.

[LatinAmericanview]

The truth value of a particular belief (Buddhism) is inconsequential. It can be true or false; however, the establishment of a consensus governing what the belief is ,is the establishment of Hierachy. Within this the experts dictate reality. Let me explain religion as a psychopathology. Imagine that psychotics build castles in the sky and neurotics live in those dwellings. Now imagine that the neurotic is anxious about his death that one day the neurotic makes an psychological association between peace of mind and running river water (Empirical Psychological justification). The Neurotic rushes home o tell his friend the Psychotic that a calming spirit resides in the river (Psychological process of transfer). The Psychotic agrees with the neurotic (consensus) and tells him that he can speak to the river spirit (lie and creation of expert ). The neurotic asks his friend what do guys speak about? (POWER TRANSFER and reality shift)

So I guess your point was that I know nothing about the truth value of Buddhist teachings because I have never studied the true words of Buddha. To this I reply, I don't believe that one person could have a better understanding of the unknowable than another person. I will give you an  example: If Hitler were alive, then would he be a blogger? Don't Answer! The Answer is we have no freaking clue what Hitler would do! He fucking dead! And if any person claims to have expert or divine revelation on the subject then they are lying psychotics. And if you believe them...

So I leave you with a question: Does the river spirit exist?

[HammerHead]

Just finished listening to your show and found it to be quite informative.

I agree that belief systems are given to people so that they can be manipulatable by the puppet masters who control the strings. Ultimate power is getting to have people believe what you want them to believe for the benefit of a small ruling elite.

Keep up the great work and I'm looking forward to show number three.

[blueocean]

The truth value of a particular belief (Buddhism) is inconsequential. It can be true or false; however, the establishment of a consensus governing what the belief is ,is the establishment of Hierachy. Within this the experts dictate reality.

This is indeed what happens (and has happened many times) when the power structure takes over the original teaching/material, and uses it for its own purposes of power transfer.

Let me explain religion as a psychopathology. Imagine that psychotics build castles in the sky and neurotics live in those dwellings. Now imagine that the neurotic is anxious about his death that one day the neurotic makes an psychological association between peace of mind and running river water (Empirical Psychological justification). The Neurotic rushes home o tell his friend the Psychotic that a calming spirit resides in the river (Psychological process of transfer). The Psychotic agrees with the neurotic (consensus) and tells him that he can speak to the river spirit (lie and creation of expert ). The neurotic asks his friend what do guys speak about? (POWER TRANSFER and reality shift) .

Interesting perception and with a lot of truth.  Sort of like the infalllible pope that speaks for 'god'.

So I guess your point was that I know nothing about the truth value of Buddhist teachings because I have never studied the true words of Buddha. To this I reply, I don't believe that one person could have a better understanding of the unknowable than another person.

My point was different, it was that when one attacks a certain teaching then one has to attack the correct teaching and not the twisted one that was/is used for control and slavery.  
example: if I say that the sky is blue, and then later people twist my words and say that I said that the sky was red, and then another comes along that attacks me for saying that the sky was red, that is my main point.

Secondly In essence you are right that all people have an equal understanding of the 'unknowable' (this term in itself holds a preconceived value/standpoint/assumption in it... ), which means that we don't need gurus or rabbis or priests or whatever.

Most people don't give a dammn about knowledge or understanding about anything, and some devote thier time and effort to this understanding (such as those on this forum) which causes a differentation in peoples understanding of something or this 'unknowable' that you talk about.

I like to understand the understanding of those people who have put their time and effort into understanding something and/or this 'unknowable' that you talk about (just as done on this forum). If those people make sense then I value that higher than people who don't make sense and sprout nonsense. (like fox/cnn zombies etc...).

To me 99% of current buddhist teachings do not make sense and are crap. (the teachings that you attacked thinking it was the original), and the more original ones make more sense to me that's all.

So I leave you with a question: Does the river spirit exist?

I will answer that with a reciprocal question: Does Consciousness or spirit exist at all?

[blueocean]

By the way:

Keep up the good work in exposing the zionist Talmudic Psychopaths with your radioshow.

[LatinAmericanview]

Unfortunately, we are a very small minority among the masses. Even fewer have or take the time ponder these problems. In that respect, we are a special group. If you want me to say that i do not know the true teaching of Buddha then I will. However neither one of us know if the true teachings are true! Sadly the religious hierarchy emerges from this  conundrum. As for the mind/body problem- let me ponder that. I know what I want to say only I need time to formulate my ideas.

Cheers
Latin

[blueocean]

I found something simple: Truth exists/is and a Lie does not exist/ is basically an 'illusion' (hypnosis etc.). ( A lie is basically a denial, or twisting, of what is/exists  is truth)

That is why on this forum, and other researchers as well, investigation into for instance zionism/talmudists find so many hard/existing evidence for the truth and expose these liars/psychopaths and the non-existent crap/lies/illusions that they sprout.

take care

Blue

[LatinAmericanview]

These problems have very long histories. Your point can see in Plato's republic "Allegory of the Cave"

[blueocean]

Go see the current movie 'The cave' which gives an interesting twist to plato's cave.  (yes the movie is bad hehe, but the twist is interesting).

Anyway: Bringing up the cave is interesting, also relating to 'how an experience /truth by a person can be shared with others'  And can these others understand/see this truth/experience?

Then you come to the debate of and between subjective and objective truth and their overlappings.

[blueocean]

Hi LAV,

In your LAV show of the 20th you give a good representation of your first reply to my points, in which you talk about the neurotic and the psychopath.

I agree with the power transfer proces that you describe.


I also know that from your responses that there is a much more fundamental difference in our positions, regarding the nature (and communication) of truth.

If I try to summarise your basic assumptions I would say they are sort of along the line of: 1 Objective Truth is basically the only Truth, and very difficult to communicate (especially if one wasn't there when it happened)

2 Subjective Truth is a belief. and a belief is basically non-truthfull. (according to objective empirical standards) This subjective truth is impossible to communicate.

3 Truth is basically unknowable and a conundrum. Only Objective empirical truth-(searching) can come close to it at best. (the cave)

In response to the theistic church crap and power games I can understand your move to the other end of the spectrum to a completely atheistic objective empirical approach to matters.
The starting point of this approach is one of non-knowing and then trying to know the truth/'unknowable'


If your position is different then represented by me here then write the corrections to me for clarification.

[LatinAmericanview]

I really hate going into this but you are certainly worth it.

1 Objective Truth is basically the only Truth, and very difficult to communicate (especially if one wasn't there when it happened)

I am not sure what you mean by this. Truth has the value of being true. The determination of truth value depends on the type of argument used deductive or inductive and the truth value if the premises.. The truth value of deductive argument can be know because the conclusion is contain within the premises.. Inductive arguments can not be proven true with absolute certainty. All the important questions are inductive. However, I think that you are referring to objective reality. Objective reality can be summed up by saying there is a "table" in the room. This table occupies space and I think that it is black in color. You enter the room and have the same impression. No one enters the room but still the table exists. The table exists independent of the observer. And when there is an observer "some sort" of consensus is reached about the nature of reality/table. So you and I are seeing the exactly same table but we come close enough to be able to come to some agreement that it is in fact a table. The reason the table is seems different to us is because we occupy different and unique perspectives. So the great thinkers of th past inferred that objective reality did exist but that we see it through some sort of filter. Hence "the cave allegory ."

2 Subjective Truth is a belief. and a belief is basically non-truthfull. (according to objective empirical standards) This subjective truth is impossible to communicate.

The truth is always objective.  The truth is independent any observer. So the table exists. This could be an example of objective reality (which we never directly perceive). The table looks different to you and me. This is an example of subjective reality. Now I claim that the table is black. This observation is validated by another person. We both measure that the light reflected by the table is X. X is defined as the reflective range of Black#444444 as per the standard measurement of XXXXX School. After all this shit- I can claim to see a black table. This is a tentative truth about the world but we are not absolutely certain about our claim.

The truth is knowable but with many conditions and restrictions.

[LatinAmericanview]

Be calm friend.
Truth comes from the inside of your soul.

Hey I thought you might like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BP2l88CNw4E

[blueocean]

Your point is well described.

You are using the Western mode towards truth and 'objective' reality, which disregards the eastern approach.

Only Goethe tried to turn the tide.

More recently a  different approach has come up, which is more in tune with Goethe and the Eastern approach.


ps: did you notice that you concurred with my description of your position?  I said of your position: "1 Objective Truth is basically the only Truth "      you said later : " The truth is always objective."  and "The truth is independent of any observer".

[blueocean]

Be calm friend.
Truth comes from the inside of your soul.

Not sure why you quote this................Mmmmmmm


1 I was calm so using some sort of a chill pill out of the blue is a bit strange.....

2 saying that Truth comes from the inside of ones soul contradicts your objective truth stands.... and also your atheistic standpoint.

[LatinAmericanview]

Well our conversations show the difficult of these very important concepts. I put a link up for Hireality because this video has the famous "I am mad as hell" speech which concludes to seek truth in yourself.

[LatinAmericanview]

ps: did you notice that you concurred with my description of your position?  I said of your position: "1 Objective Truth is basically the only Truth "      you said later : " The truth is always objective."  and "The truth is independent of any observer".

Yes, I did

[blueocean]

I put a link up for Hireality because this video has the famous "I am mad as hell" speech which concludes to seek truth in yourself.

It is a good speech for sure. I have seen it many times

furthermore however   :
I am in the business of pointing out contradictions : saying/concluding that people should seek the
truth in themselves contradicts your objective truth stands and that of scientific empiric materialism.


just an obversation.  

[LatinAmericanview]

furthermore however :
I am in the business of pointing out contradictions : saying/concluding that people should seek the
truth in themselves contradicts your objective truth stands and that of scientific empiric materialism.

Nice Try! Really! Scientific empiric materialism it is a religion! This is a rather big point. This has to do with assumed premises and belief. Anyway, I have been kind to respond to your inquires with honest answers. You have exhausted me. This is not a philosophy forum. So lets us stick with the forum topic. Or I can suggest a few books.

Cheers

[blueocean]

Showing all the 'religions and philosophies' (including scientific materialism and zionist christians etc..)
that are being used to enslave us is important in my view for exposing the power elite ' Talmudic
kabbalists/Zionists/Jewish Bankers/satanists/psychopaths etc'

AND for not falling into new traps, and for coming up with lasting solutions for real freedom etc. .

Most of these corrupt philosophies and religions are in the business of human degradation , disempowerment and enslavement which they have in common.    ;(

Using this common thread as a test for whatever philosophy/religion/law etc.  will bring one a long way.............

[LatinAmericanview]

Showing all the 'religions and philosophies' (including scientific materialism and zionist christians etc..)
that are being used to enslave us is important in my view for exposing the power elite ' Talmudic
kabbalists/Zionists/Jewish Bankers/satanists/psychopaths etc'

AND for not falling into new traps, and for coming up with lasting solutions for real freedom etc. .

I agree with you here! Unfortunately, understanding this stuff is rather hard for some people. Again,, This well worth the effort but it is mentally taxing.

[blueocean]

I will soon post findings in the talmudic kabbalah thread that shows a common thread that ALL of these enslaving philosophies and religions share,
even though they are supposed to be diametrically opposed to one another.

[LatinAmericanview]

Don't forget the major political movements are also the same thing! Maybe I will do a show on my personal theory (please say it Samuel Jackson voice) THE TRIANGLE OF POWER!

[blueocean]

I won't


They ALL share it.