“Off Tangent Show # 14 with your host Latin

[LatinAmericanview]

I'm sure he's sincere and he probably believes he's a good man with benevolent intentions, but I desperately want to wring his chicken neck and bash in his smug face.

He essentially admits that security has usurped defense, and that force can and should be projected anywhere that doesn't integrate with "free trade" practices. In other words, he takes what those of us who know about deep history and flat out says it's a great thing that the military works for Wall Street. That's borne out by his work as a strategic consultant for the so-called Y2K project with Cantor-Fitzgerald (CEO one "Lucky" Howard Lutnick), which included bona fide war game scenarios run "atop the World Trade Center." He brags about how when the towers fell (well, really kinda atomized in mid-air) their scenarios "went live." In other words, it was the New Pearl Harbor needed to justify dividing the world according to his paradigm of the "functioning core" and the "non-integrated gap."
http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/pnm/map_index.htm

Basically, any entity that does not adhere to the rule-sets of "free trade" is targeted for regime change and nation-building. On a global scale, this is exactly the nightmare scenario of global predator forces roaming the world whacking anyone that doesn't fall in line with the way the ones with the biggest guns define it.

There are many more subtle and complex implications of what this, ahem, individual espouses that I cannot articulate without ranting, so hopefully other members will take a look into these materials and discuss in more detail.

Source: Kolnidre info underground

Topics covered:
Thomas Barnett
Cantor Fitzgerald
Military Enforcers
Oppression
Peak Oil
Cold War
The Guardian Class
The Administrators
http://theinfounderground.com/ftp/lav/oft14.mp3

[GordZilla]

Latin,
 You didn't leave me much to debate you on in that show, good job! (everyone here thanks you with a collective 'sigh'   :lol: )  Of course I can find one small detail   , however I believe you know this anyways; 'Russia fell and America grew', this concept all though seeming true when viewed from the outside, shouldn't be bought into by someone like you. Someone who's awake to their bullsh#t. By now, you must understand that both sides were working with the international bankers, and both are moving ahead exactly as planned. I think it was in your last video you posted where Norman Dodd states (while paraphrasing what his boss had told him); "We're just getting America ready for communist rule" . 'Communism' understand is nothing more than a dictatorship with a new title. As 'communism' is good on paper but it never works in practice and their leaders know this. Communism didn't go away, or lose or anything of the sort. If there is a world government, which doctrine do you think it will more closely resemble? Communism is the answer, a rose by any other name. And again, as with the bankers. 'Communism' is their invention.
 The cold war was fake, and so is the perceived rise and fall of America and USSR. It's always been 'show business', always controlled and always for one common goal.

-Gord

P.S. The answer for whether or not 'China is involved' can be found by following the common brands painted on shipping containers, and not just those that are blatant about being from China. Take a close look at the other companies that are also into international shipping. Look real close into these companies and exactly what they do and you'll discover China is bought and paid for... of course you won't be surprised by who.

[LatinAmericanview]

The cold war was fake, and so is the perceived rise and fall of America and USSR.

Agreed! I must have goofed! It is was false dichotomy'.  Russia and the US - good cop bad cop. Stalin might have gone off the reservation for a while but not much more then that.  Thanks for the compliments

[Anonymous]

I think Latin did a decent job at explaining how the two sides were controlled:
"two sides of a false dichotomy... and in the end the US won, Russia lost so to speak, but we all really lost that's kinda the point"


I will add my take on what happened.  Communism was the desired mechanism to take control of the resources and the people of the planet, to establish their NWO.  It was the quickest and most effective way to do it, but received major opposition by those not indoctrinated or accepting of such an ideology.  The Democratic stylized world order was in opposition, especially the peoples of the respective countries who favored their system vs the Communist one.  The US was not completely controlled.  Good vs evil ideology emerge.  Mini-wars were made of Capitalism vs Communism, US vs Soviets, Democracy vs Socialism, etc with allegiances being made for each respective super-power.  While this was a created conflict, the outcome would determine who had the most power and influence (in actuality or perception) and who was able to take over the reigns of leading the world to a NWO.  The US form of governance and global security was more appealing to many countries.  In the end the Communist system could not be maintained or it was brought down purposefully in order to allow the desired victor to emerge triumphant ->  the USA.  Why would the USA be more desired?  The perceivable peaceful, righteous and benevolent system was most favored.  People were more willing to accept a system that has the appearance of being great and perfect.  While the populace of the Western democracies were against the concepts of communism, Marxist intellectuals and others (particularly some intellectual "Jews") were all the while able to - and continue to - bring about social change through subversive ideological shifts in the philosophy of life for the democratic countries, i.e. social movements of all kinds (feminism, sex, gay rights, etc).  The "new left" is made the enemy, associated with communism,  Today the conflict of "leftist" communism still exists, but is more accepted - than in the past - through the social engineering mechanisms used to make it favorable to the populace.  Some hard "righters" still see the left as their enemy, and associate them with Communism, Marxism... yet still remain clueless to identify the intellectuals who brought about all the destructive social changes to the established Christian ruleset that was the effective order of the USA.  The same ideological people have infiltrated the conservative group as well... again a controlled opposition.  Many ignorant "right-wingers" don't accept the reality of 9/11 because they have blind faith in the false paradigm of their Republican government and see the "9/11 truther" "left" as deceitful communists who are trying to destroy the government of the USA.  Stuck int heir own little bubble of lies.  So now this acceptance of communist concepts has become part of the indoctrination of democratic society.  Step by step things have moved from Republic representative government to communistic dictatorship.



About the show, some issues I have....

Financial class, and military class -> Form global governance order.  Above that is the overseers who properly assign tasks in the cooperation of the two previous groups.  You say the overseers are not known ... yet they stand above the other two groups.

You mention administrators.  Some "Jews" are financial wizards, but you also say some "Jews" comprise administrators.  Are not the administrators the overseers?  Isn't that how you administrate, by overseeing things?  Wouldn't the administrators, like Barnett and others such as "Jewish" and non-"Jewish" intellectual/philosophical masters, be the overseers in coordinating the compliance between the military and financial guilds?

The problem is that it seemed you were saying those powerful "Jews" were in one place - as admins and financial sector, with the military in the other corner, while yet another third group - the ideological implementers i.e. overseers - are above both but are not comprised of these same "Jews" who are the administrators.  So what I'm getting at is: aren't some of these ruling financial/admin "Jews" part of the intellectual administration that is the overseer group, making that group not so unknown and ambiguous as you would seem to make them?  i.e. making the admin group in some way the overseer group, if not completely then at least partially so?  Or is there another admin group above the "Jewish" admins?

Another way to state the problem is:  The reason for the conflict in your explanation is, you say these particular "Jewish" elites are financial and administrative, but not overseers because they are only focused on the the monetary mathematical control, without insight into the military security enforcement.  And the military group is focused on the security aspect without the financial aspect.  Therefore you conclude another group is needed to oversee these two groups and apply the administration for both groups to cooperate effectively, thereby removing the effective definition of the "Jewish" administrators, making them relegated to merely financial wizards without the administrative overseer function.

Please address this in the next show.

Peace.

**EDIT**
 I want to add that the problem is with the words used to encapsulate a definition for these groups.  My conflict is really the use of admins for one group while they are not overseers.

Overseer:  : SUPERVISOR, SUPERINTENDENT
Administer:  1 : to manage or supervise the execution, use, or conduct of

I know you mean the philosophical ideological driving force are the overseers that have been developing and adding to previously conceived concepts ... maybe another name for them though  I confused myself when trying to separate the two groups... but I'll leave my above attempt at describing what I saw as the conflict for those who might think the same thing  Also, one aspect that eludes me is how this group of thinkers is able to exert control over others... wouldn't the thinkers/overseers be required to cooperate themselves with the current power of the financial masters to establish a functional plan to create the utopian order, as opposed to dominate over them?  Money is nothing, but that is where the power is in our current world order, no?

[Canard]

Interesting show Latin, really looking forward to the next one.  I like your angle on the Iran coverage too, at some point certain issues ARE bigger then others.

[Anonymous]

Latin

I mean no disrespect, but it seems to me that you are describing the social structure of the Planet of the Apes.

The chimpanzees are the scientists and thinkers, the orangutans are the politicians, and the gorillas are the warriors.

I would say that the only thing missing is the bankers and corporations but I would classify them as orangutans, since so many move in and out of politics.

The only thing left to define is the Grape Ape, I mean the Great Ape.



I would point out that in escape from the planet of the apes, Cesar was the name of the Ape that led the rebellion.

I could be wrong

[Canard]

LOL'd ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ best post ever!!!!!

[LatinAmericanview]

Ok Guys here is some supplemental material to help you guys understand the structure of the whole thing. Please listen to the supplement show first and then watch these videos.  I will work on the next show meanwhile.
Cheers Latin
[youtube:2pfsf4fi]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4ePsL3CU28[/youtube]2pfsf4fi]

[youtube:2pfsf4fi]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1jLYmjLUIk[/youtube]2pfsf4fi]

[GordZilla]

Latin,

 You continue to assume that we need help understanding this 'whole thing', I do not understand your belief that you are somehow further advanced in the pursuit of truth based solely on your ability to compartmentalize the 'conspiracy' even further into its complication. It's not needed, over-thinking this will do nothing for us. Understanding our enemy in their nature is what we need to focus on, not the intricacies of their internal structure.

Seriously;

 1. Who gives a f@ck? I know they are the ruling class not because I study their inner workings, although I have spent time on that, but rather because I know the original 'deceivers with an agenda' were not and are not deceived by anyone else, nor are they ruled by anyone else. (barring the mythical or real; 'Satan'). Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it? Just know they did it thru lies, deception, murder and usury. Expose them by living your own life in the opposite direction, if we all do it then they tend to stand out. Don't misconstrue trickery as being intelligence. They worked their deception on an easy target, but threw the years they have always been found out. Why ? Was it from studying their inner structure? No, it was by knowing the difference between good and evil and having the moral amplitude to do something about it (an amplitude, btw,  they've worked hard to destroy)...again who gives a f@ck what they're doing behind the curtain? Just rip it down! Every Talmudic Jew is your enemy, period.  What else do you need to know?

 2. For God's sake look to the source already. You can't keep ignoring it when everything about them and their ways was exposed for you a long time ago in that book. When everything about this conspiracy smacks of the supernatural and the religious (hell even the secular parts seem to borrow the symbology and language). You don't even have to believe in God and still that book is the best for understanding our enemy, at least all we need to know anyways.  Where did the term 'Jew' come from? How about 'Israel'? Where was it first written not to practice usury and shun those that do?  Where is it first written that these people will use their oral law (the law of no effect) to eventually undermine all that is righteous? Is none of this panning out, right there in front of you? These examples are not alone, and nothing you put forward will ever top the understanding of the 'Talmudic Jew' that that book contains. This is the 'elephant in the room' that Mutha was referring to. It's right in front of you guys, but it seems your media driven preconceptions of God is the hardest thing for you to drop.  So the most successful weapon ever used, and repeatedly I might add, to defeat these people will never by adopted by you guys out of nothing, nothing but bias? (as you still have no other way to explain away these facts ... don't worry- nor do I  and I didn't take lightly to the 'God' thing either. I was not born an alter boy and I still live in sin)


Please, with all due respect, stop referring to us as 'you guys'. It should be 'us' and 'we'. And also please stop speaking down to us, as if we can hardly follow these concepts.  You're shit is tight I'll admit, but you must include the listener, not speak from a pulpit. (btw on Ognir's show you did seem more humble, honest and down to earth - perhaps that contrast is needed) We are ALL in this together. After all, as you said this in a recent post;

"It amazes me how people could still follow people like Alex Jones(present company (excluded). Anyone who reaches some sort of enlightenment 6 or 7 years after the fact should not be leading any type of movement. Honestly- Do really want someone who is 6/7 years behind the learning curve?."

I could say the same to you from my perspective, I'm only reminding you of this. I will not stress this point further, as you do learn fast and are very intelligent. I'm only using this to humble you a little.    To 'keep your feet on the ground',  'keep it real' - so to speak. Exploring the intricacies of their deception, is like counting the corn in someone's shit. Instead just point out the culprit for the rest of us and then start the cleaning! We can deal with the shit distributers after they are fully identified.

No it's not every Jew, but it is every Talmudic Jew, and frankly from a people so vociferous in every other 'human rights' and other like movements, they are awfully quiet on this one.  This puts, in my opinion anyways, the onus on them to prove their innocence and on an individual scale -although I have a feeling this will later be done for us.  Till then it's quite obvious that none should be trusted until proven to be trustworthy, none!  This is why history repeats; we initially trust them, we slowly learn the trust was misplaced, we rid ourselves of them and return to our slumber, then repeat. They will not change their spots. And this time around their prize is the whole enchilada, this is it folks!  Know your enemy, care not about his method, just expose him in its fallacy.

It won't be the Brave New World, it won't be like anything Sci-fi might have envisioned. Only those willing to be slaves will be left alive, and frankly for anyone who has followed this conspiracy so far, it's unlikely to be them. We like our freedom, even if now it's limited down to virtually only 'mental freedom', we still, none-the-less, will NOT have it stolen from us. Hell even the 'intelligent' of the sheeple will not allow this to happen to them either. Human nature is often underestimated as with the human will. The future is bloody, beyond anything we've known thus far and it is so precisely because we are likely to fight. Pray you die in the beginning, as surviving the initial onslaught will only make you pray for death later, at which point it shall not come.

 Or , figure out their inner structure, the historical way these structures always come into being etc. Then what?   ... Oh yeah, back to praying!

-Gord

P.s. I really do not have much opinion formed of Bacon whatsoever, but I do respect this quote, you offered,  from him;
"a little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism; but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion."

P.S.S. Hope you do not try to prove the 'ruling class' is anything but the Kabalistic Talmudic Jew, you will have an uphill battle on that issue if you do. As stated above they are the original group(race? Religion?) of people to adopt deception as a primary method to gain power, they have done it from day one, they are still doing it today... check the Mossad's motto.  To think anyone but Satan has ever, or will ever, best them at their own game is ludicrous at best. (an insight that 'knowing your enemy' will give) The only 'victory', perceived or real, is obtained first by not playing this game, and second by recognizing and publically condemning the inherent evils contained within it.


"Lies over time, they float to the surface.
Lies over time, they equal the surface.
Lies over time, though the reasons desert us.
Lies over time, with no apparent purpose.
Until  we me again, let's stay engaged" –The Tragically Hip – Let's stay Engaged.

[Anonymous]

Understanding our enemy in their nature is what we need to focus on, not the intricacies of their internal structure.

And don't we need to look at the way all of them do things, not just "Jews"?  To do this you need to understand all of the philosophies of evil, not simply limiting your view on the "trunk" the "Jewish" mindset.  So you don't need to continue to apply a metaphor as if it only applies to those interested in Latin's shows, as they do apply to you as well.  You seem to fail to understand the importance in uncovering the underlying ideological motives behind them all.

Why are you harping so much on his method of going about uncovering the conspiracy in detail?  If you already know all of this, good for you.  If you are so upset with the material presented and feel it is not the right way to make an audio recording, then why don't you make your own and show us how the real fight is done?  Otherwise, listen to it, like it or don't like is your choice, but how about stepping back and not always making posts about how the rest of us still don't understand things like you do.

Who gives a f@ck?

Well I do.  Latin does.  And so do others.  If you don't, why bother wasting yout time expresing your disdain for the material covered if you do not care?  Time and time again you make the similar posts of the same nature.  GIve it up already, no?  You want to keep complaining while you do not provide any more significant evidence other than the Bible that will supposedly show us what we are missing?

I know they are the ruling class not because I study their inner workings, although I have spent time on that, but rather because I know the original 'deceivers with an agenda' were not and are not deceived by anyone else, nor are they ruled by anyone else.

Ok, so they are the ruling class.  No one else is.  Is that it?  How do you know?  Please share your evidence with us.  You say you have spent time on the "inner workings", so enlighten us in the evidence that they are indeed, unequivocally the leaders over all men on this planet.  Can you?  Latin is going through important aspect of history to uncover the detail, but as you said, that does not interest you.  So move along if it doesn't interest you.  Are you going to repeatedly make these long posts every time there is a show?

What about the ruling class in the past?  Do you contend they have always been the ruling class?  Care to share with us this proof as well?  Again, Latin is interested in exposing the history behind the ideology of how we got to where we are.  If you are not interested, move along.  There are plenty of people who are.  If you want someone to do a show the way you want it, make your own.

Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it?

Know thy enemy.  understanding how it is structured is part of knowing the enemy.  Again, since you rhetorically ask that question, it indicates you don't think spending time on the subject is of merit, so move along and spend time the way you want to spend it.

Just know they did it thru lies, deception, murder and usury. Expose them by living your own life in the opposite direction, if we all do it then they tend to stand out.

Aren't we?  Don't we already understand their deceit and are not in agreement with it, and thereby do not follow such ways?

Don't misconstrue trickery as being intelligence. They worked their deception on an easy target, but threw the years they have always been found out. Why ? Was it from studying their inner structure? No, it was by knowing the difference between good and evil and having the moral amplitude to do something about it (an amplitude, btw,  they've worked hard to destroy)...again who gives a f@ck what they're doing behind the curtain? Just rip it down!

Actually, to get away with trickery, deceit and lies, you have to be intelligent.  If they aren't intelligent, then it is us who are too dumb to see it, and thereby making them smarter than us.  Take your pick!  I prefer to acknowledge their evil intelligence, while adhering to our own.

Every Talmudic Jew is your enemy, period.  What else do you need to know?

After reading my above statements, I think it can be more clear to you now what else there is to know.  It is not simply the "Jewish" philosophy that identifies who an enemy is, there is more to it than that.  Until we can prove that it is only the "Jewish" philosophy, then we need to continue to uncover what actual truth lies behind the ideology.  Do you contend the "Jews" are the originators of "lies, deception, murder and usury"?  Is the only proof of this the Bible?  If so, how can you pick and choose what truths you want to accept and what falsifications you want to deny in a book where mythology, history, storytelling, poems, and recurring motifs are used?  How do you know the information in such a wide literarily composed work is so honest and factual about such a matter?  You have no doubt about that aspect of authenticity?  What about the superstitious/theological aspect?  Are those also without doubt in authenticity for you?  How do you reconcile accepting certain information in this book versus others?

I was being a devil's advocate in the above paragraph to illustrate the lack of credibility in simply using the Bible as a source to prove what is going on, as if somehow - given the statements you continually make - it is the only thing we need to look at that we fail to look at.  As if something that will solve everything.  I do accept that they were usurious, lying, deceitful, and murderous, and have continued to do so at times in history.  But I will not use one book called the Bible to substantiate that claim alone, as you appear to be implying.  You are continually posting about how all we need to know is in that age-old book.  So we see that in that book it tells us about their ancient practices, and how many "Jews" today still follow the same philosophical methods.  This is all we need?  To take the Bible, read the parts that show us who the "Jews" are so we can associate them with the "Jews" of today and identify them?  Ok.  Well i submit we don't need the Bible to do that.  Everyone here pretty much understands this without holding onto the Bible as the crux of knowledge, as the one source we need to pay attention to to understand what is going on.  It is bigger than just one book written in part 2-3k years ago, Gordzilla.

For God's sake look to the source already. You can't keep ignoring it when everything about them and their ways was exposed for you a long time ago in that book.

Yes I will agree that book does lay claim as the original source of information on their ways.  So, what then?

When everything about this conspiracy smacks of the supernatural and the religious (hell even the secular parts seem to borrow the symbology and language).

Ok, prove to use this whole conspiracy is simply related to supernatural and religious concepts.  Can you do this?  It is a part, but it is not "everything about this conspiracy" that "smacks of the supernatural and the religious".  It is more than that.  Have you been listening to the Off Tangent shows?  Are you rejecting certain information to validate your perceptions of the shows?  i.e. that the philosophy of creating the "utopian" society where humans are most effectively managed does not lay simply in "the supernatural and the religious" .i.e that the scientific rationality plays a huge part in the current machinations undertaken by our self-appointed masters.  Are you blocking these things out when you claim "the supernatural and the religious" are the "everything"?  All you need to do is go back and look at the shows Latin has made and there is ample exposure on the people behind such drives to control us in a rational nihilistic way, i.e. Charles Galton Darwin, Bertrand Russell, George Orwell, Aldous Huxley, and more.

You don't even have to believe in God and still that book is the best for understanding our enemy, at least all we need to know anyways.

Again, you claim it is all we need to know.  Alright.  Good for you.  That is all you need to know.  Move along.  Let us learn other things if we so choose to.  We already know the things in that book.  Why do you incessantly continue to repeat it?

Where did the term 'Jew' come from? How about 'Israel'?

The term "Jew" did not come from Israel.  The term for an Israeli back in the day was Yisraelite.  The term "Jew" later emerged from applying the letter "J" in the place of the letter "Y" for the word Yudaean.  On a secondary note, "Jew" and "Jewish" are the improper noun and adjective derivations for the word Judean, properly they are Judaist and Judaic.  I only use those terms when referring to someone of Pentateuch of Tanakh religious following, but usually just use my quoted "Jew" to indicate the word is used incorrectly.  Just thought I would throw in that bit of info in this discussion about your post.  To continue on the word Yudean/Judean.  A Judean was properly a descendant of Judah, but over some time it was a person living in Judea who was either a Judean from Judahs lineage, a philosophical Judean, or simply living there.  With all the immigration and such it was hard to make the exclusive distinction, many meanings developed.  Also, it is claimed now amongst some scholars that Judean was later used as an outsider group name, while Israelite was used as an insider group name for those of Israel.

Where was it first written not to practice usury and shun those that do?  Where is it first written that these people will use their oral law (the law of no effect) to eventually undermine all that is righteous? Is none of this panning out, right there in front of you? These examples are not alone, and nothing you put forward will ever top the understanding of the 'Talmudic Jew' that that book contains.

Who has denied this understanding of a Talmudic "Jew"?  Where did you get the impression we did not understand this?  I can only assume you repeat the obvious because you perceive us as not understanding this concept -> "Is none of this panning out, right there in front of you?".  There is plenty more evidence that goes into more detail than this one book.  There is plenty of evidence that needs to be known to show that the old "Jews" depicted in the Bible are sharing the same philosophy today.  You cannot limit your scope to that one book Gordzilla.  Do you comprehend why?  We need to look at current evidence of their behavior to show that they are currently acting that way.  You cannot limit the investigation to some group of people that were said to act a certain way two thousand years ago.  Good luck convincing anyone that today's "Jews" believe the same things if you only use the Bible to prove your point.  Do you understand why your limited claims of "all we need to know" about them is not sufficient?  Will you please stop claiming the Bible is all we need to read to understand them?  I hope I have illustrated this point.

This is the 'elephant in the room' that Mutha was referring to. It's right in front of you guys, but it seems your media driven preconceptions of God is the hardest thing for you to drop.

That is very funny.  So now you claim our only problem with our perception of "God" comes from the media?  As if we haven't spent time looking into the issue ourselves?  How nice of you to assume such a straw man argument to attack.  Please continue...

So the most successful weapon ever used, and repeatedly I might add, to defeat these people will never by adopted by you guys out of nothing, nothing but bias? (as you still have no other way to explain away these facts ... don't worry- nor do I  and I didn't take lightly to the 'God' thing either. I was not born an alter boy and I still live in sin)

I'm glad you continued to attack the straw man.  No it isn't bias.  You claim we only have bias, yet you know nothing about our contemplation in the matter nor the road of inquiry we traveled to reach our conclusion.  You also claim we "have no other way to explain away these facts"... huh?  What facts are we explaining away?  The aforementioned information about Talmudic "Jews", usury, lies, deceit, murder?  When have we ignored such claims about those "Jews" that are like this?  Care to point these out?  Pretty much everyone on the forum is in agreement there are bad "Jews" out there who have such a mindset.  Or is there other information that you claim we are explaining "away" via our bias of "media driven preconceptions of God"? (again a false claim)

Please, with all due respect, stop referring to us as 'you guys'. It should be 'us' and 'we'.  And also please stop speaking down to us, as if we can hardly follow these concepts.

As you have said, you have already looked into the "inner workings", and are clearly not interested in hearing Latin present such information, so when Latin says, "we", "us", "you" in trying to explain issues, he is not speaking to you as you do not consider yourself to be included in such a grouping.  If you were interested in Latin's topic of discussion, he is referring to me and everyone who is listening as people who likely have not heard this information before, and since he already knows it, it wouldn't be correct to include himself in addressing new information. Latin has used collective words before to express a collective understanding of the information presented at TIU to build upon an understanding we all have and then present his new information, sometimes in analogous forms.  Stop being so touchy dude.  You seem to want to pick at any little thing said to bring down the validity of the usefulness of his shows.  I think you have already brought up this lame claim in a previous comment.  You are insulted by your perception that Latin is speaking down to you?  Stop listening...

We are ALL in this together.

Yes, so how about you act like it and focus on real issues rather than attempting to deconstruct the validity of the Off Tangent material.  I made several comments above why this info is important, maybe now you will see it as well.

I'm only using this to humble you a little.    To 'keep your feet on the ground',  'keep it real' - so to speak.

I submit you need to float down off the religious cloud and start respecting other peoples choice of material they want to discuss and listen to, when it isn't derived or focused on the Bible as a source of information.

Exploring the intricacies of their deception, is like counting the corn in someone's shit. Instead just point out the culprit for the rest of us and then start the cleaning! We can deal with the shit distributers after they are fully identified.

You can point all you want, but no one is going to move unless they are convinced of the factual validity of the claims being made.  The Bible is NOT going to cut it!  Does that make sense?  Hence the need to uncover the actuality behind what has been happening, which you seem very little concerned about. Judging from your posts it gives that impression, maybe I'm not understanding your claims in the way you intended to present them... sorry if that is the case.

This puts, in my opinion anyways, the onus on them to prove their innocence and on an individual scale -although I have a feeling this will later be done for us.  Till then it's quite obvious that none should be trusted until proven to be trustworthy, none!

Yup, a lot of us understand this too  A lot of them have proven to be trustworthy, ask Og, he has a good friend he can vouch for.

Know your enemy, care not about his method, just expose him in its fallacy.

As I stated early on in this discourse, that is one of the goals of uncovering the details, to better know, to better understand, to better identify.  It isn't the "Jews" only, Gordy... you need to practice what you preach and look at the fallacies in what you are saying.  "Who gives a f@ck?" ... "Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it?".  These statements were uses to belittle the validity of the current Off Tangent, that you do not agree with the reasons for talking about such things.  You seem to fail to see why the shows apply to knowing the enemy, and that is, all of the enemy, not just one particular group.

Or , figure out their inner structure, the historical way these structures always come into being etc. Then what?   ... Oh yeah, back to praying!

What?  That doesn't make sense?  Go back to praying?  Maybe you would... but we sure as hell won't!  No time for praying to some being that may or may not exist.. wtf has that thing ever done for you or anyone else that you can prove?  Or is it that you believe "Gods" hand will help you?  Or has helped anyone?  Or will help us fight the enemy?  We are the only ones who can do it!

P.S.S. Hope you do not try to prove the 'ruling class' is anything but the Kabalistic Talmudic Jew, you will have an uphill battle on that issue if you do.

Sure we can agree the Talmudic "Jews" play a crucial role in our current affairs.  Have they always held this position?  No.  If you say yes, prove that they have always been the "ruling class".  That will be something I would like to see.  Those who fail to understand history and doomed to repeat it, or something like that.  There is more than just the "Jewish" history to learn about Gordzila.  It all ties in together.  I hope you can come to realize that.

Peace.

[Canard]

Great post Az, this is what the point of the matter is and your got all over it.
Thank you!

[GordZilla]

Understanding our enemy in their nature is what we need to focus on, not the intricacies of their internal structure.

And don't we need to look at the way all of them do things, not just "Jews"?  To do this you need to understand all of the philosophies of evil, not simply limiting your view on the "trunk" the "Jewish" mindset.  So you don't need to continue to apply a metaphor as if it only applies to those interested in Latin's shows, as they do apply to you as well.  You seem to fail to understand the importance in uncovering the underlying ideological motives behind them all.

Hello? Is this thing on? You hear yourself? 'philosophies of evil'? what? The root, perhaps? 'Underlying ideological motives ...behind them all'   ...Are you listening? this is exactly what I'm illustrating!

 

Why are you harping so much on his method of going about uncovering the conspiracy in detail?  If you already know all of this, good for you.  If you are so upset with the material presented and feel it is not the right way to make an audio recording, then why don't you make your own and show us how the real fight is done?  Otherwise, listen to it, like it or don't like is your choice, but how about stepping back and not always making posts about how the rest of us still don't understand things like you do.

As I've explained already I'm not a radio host, and I explained why. But again; first it started with two blanket insults, and me challenging the validity of them, a challenge still left uncontested btw. Second his message is  misleading and distracting whether intentional or not, especially in light of his base arguments being flawed. And third, his presentation is exactly how you describe me, ironically enough; "the rest of us still don't understand things like you do". That's exactly the message I hear him trying to convey when he talks this way to his audience.

Who gives a f@ck?

Well I do.  Latin does.  And so do others.  If you don't, why bother wasting yout time expresing your disdain for the material covered if you do not care?  Time and time again you make the similar posts of the same nature.  GIve it up already, no?  You want to keep complaining while you do not provide any more significant evidence other than the Bible that will supposedly show us what we are missing?

Just a little out of context, no? (you can do better than this) I was saying who gives a fuck about the intricacies  . However to address your question There is no 'more significant evidence', there is no better tool to use in this fight, I can't imagine any better way to know your enemy either. And if it's 'supposedly', how come nothing but crickets form you regarding my first questions, posed to Latin in counter to his inflammatory remarks. You can't answer it either , however you're foolishly convinced it's 'supposed' evidence. Really? Than debunk it.  Address the point.

I know they are the ruling class not because I study their inner workings, although I have spent time on that, but rather because I know the original 'deceivers with an agenda' were not and are not deceived by anyone else, nor are they ruled by anyone else.

Ok, so they are the ruling class.  No one else is.  Is that it?  How do you know?  Please share your evidence with us.  You say you have spent time on the "inner workings", so enlighten us in the evidence that they are indeed, unequivocally the leaders over all men on this planet.  Can you?  Latin is going through important aspect of history to uncover the detail, but as you said, that does not interest you.  So move along if it doesn't interest you.  Are you going to repeatedly make these long posts every time there is a show?

See above and earlier posts, already provided more than you can answer. Latin is going thru an intricate and unnecessary description of an evil that is best described and discovered by the original road map. Do you think no one has looked at it closer? You think they all awoke only after 9/11? Come'on.  And within my original post that you are currently trying to refute I've explained how we can know it's the Talmudic Jew behind it all. Others are mislead , perhaps by greed, perhaps by other things, but the root ..the source ..the original deception comes from?

What about the ruling class in the past?  Do you contend they have always been the ruling class?  Care to share with us this proof as well?  Again, Latin is interested in exposing the history behind the ideology of how we got to where we are.  If you are not interested, move along.  There are plenty of people who are.  If you want someone to do a show the way you want it, make your own.

The ruling class have always been those in power, obviously, they have always looked to pirate this power, they succeed, abuse it then lose it...and repeat.... This time around they will not lose it.  God again, thought I've explained this?  I am exposing the history behind it, and the ideology about how we got where we are. You, Latin, Canard, cannot rebuke my points but know I'm wrong. Seems to be you know it only because if its about God it can't be right, cause frankly even still you have nothing to counter my original points. I will continue to post, until booted I guess, because I don't feel, at all,that Latin is "interested in exposing the history behind the ideology of how we got to where we are" If he was he'd have to at least consider what he can not readily write off. I've provided that, I'm not alone on my opinion either (although it may seem so in this forum) and he (and others) has simply choose to ignore those points. It makes you uncomfortable I know, me too, but it cannot be dismissed and especially by one you claim to be about "exposing the history behind the ideology" etc.

Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it?

Know thy enemy.  understanding how it is structured is part of knowing the enemy.  Again, since you rhetorically ask that question, it indicates you don't think spending time on the subject is of merit, so move along and spend time the way you want to spend it.

No again, you missed the point and I coupled it earlier with 'in their nature' just to help clairlfy that too.  To  'know' thy enemy is not to know their modus operandi but rather to know their nature, they do not change their spots , they've been like this since day one (not just since the birth of Zionism [for example]) etc .

Just know they did it thru lies, deception, murder and usury. Expose them by living your own life in the opposite direction, if we all do it then they tend to stand out.

Aren't we?  Don't we already understand their deceit and are not in agreement with it, and thereby do not follow such ways?

Do we? Good question. In light of knowing, quite obviously (and Ognir seems to know this too), that Talmudic Jews are at the top, why then are we gonna explain how there may be other hidden 'ruling classes'?  You sure we don't?

Don't misconstrue trickery as being intelligence. They worked their deception on an easy target, but threw the years they have always been found out. Why ? Was it from studying their inner structure? No, it was by knowing the difference between good and evil and having the moral amplitude to do something about it (an amplitude, btw,  they've worked hard to destroy)...again who gives a f@ck what they're doing behind the curtain? Just rip it down!

Actually, to get away with trickery, deceit and lies, you have to be intelligent.  If they aren't intelligent, then it is us who are too dumb to see it, and thereby making them smarter than us.  Take your pick!  I prefer to acknowledge their evil intelligence, while adhering to our own.

No, that's cleverness, intelligent actions and methodologies are done for good reasons, for the betterment of people, a situation etc. Being clever denotes doing something underhanded, yes indeed on an unsuspecting trusting person or people. But this doesn't mean they are not intelligent because they are naturally trusting, does it? Does it mean they are more intelligent because they realized we are trusting and therefore they can exploit that for an evil agenda? If that's intelligence, then you're right we're all stupid, but to me it is not. It's deception and illusion practiced on an unsuspecting people, like tricking a child....oh you're so smart. 'Candy from a baby' for them. For us, 'it's wrong to take candy from a baby'. Who is more intelligent?

Every Talmudic Jew is your enemy, period.  What else do you need to know?

After reading my above statements, I think it can be more clear to you now what else there is to know.  It is not simply the "Jewish" philosophy that identifies who an enemy is, there is more to it than that.  Until we can prove that it is only the "Jewish" philosophy, then we need to continue to uncover what actual truth lies behind the ideology.  Do you contend the "Jews" are the originators of "lies, deception, murder and usury"?  Is the only proof of this the Bible?  If so, how can you pick and choose what truths you want to accept and what falsifications you want to deny in a book where mythology, history, storytelling, poems, and recurring motifs are used?  How do you know the information in such a wide literarily composed work is so honest and factual about such a matter?  You have no doubt about that aspect of authenticity?  What about the superstitious/theological aspect?  Are those also without doubt in authenticity for you?  How do you reconcile accepting certain information in this book versus others?

I was being a devil's advocate in the above paragraph to illustrate the lack of credibility in simply using the Bible as a source to prove what is going on, as if somehow - given the statements you continually make - it is the only thing we need to look at that we fail to look at.  As if something that will solve everything.  I do accept that they were usurious, lying, deceitful, and murderous, and have continued to do so at times in history.  But I will not use one book called the Bible to substantiate that claim alone, as you appear to be implying.  You are continually posting about how all we need to know is in that age-old book.  So we see that in that book it tells us about their ancient practices, and how many "Jews" today still follow the same philosophical methods.  This is all we need?  To take the Bible, read the parts that show us who the "Jews" are so we can associate them with the "Jews" of today and identify them?  Ok.  Well i submit we don't need the Bible to do that.  Everyone here pretty much understands this without holding onto the Bible as the crux of knowledge, as the one source we need to pay attention to to understand what is going on.  It is bigger than just one book written in part 2-3k years ago, Gordzilla.

Again, the points I made earlier cover all you posted above, but simply put if you can't disprove them, then there is truth to this book (and that is flipping obvious) and therefore you may just have to take all of it for truth, AS AGAIN you have now way to debunk what I put to Latin much earlier. I do not pick and choose, I believe the whole word. Scares the crap out of me to as He is a hard ass. And until you can actually prove against my earlier points than yeah that proves it's authentic. As for why? Well again refer to earlier posts, namely IT'S OUR BEST WEAPON AGAINST THEM HENCE THE REASON IT'S ALWAYS THE FIRST THING ATTACKED BY THEM. Here's the proof in it's usefulness; we made it to 2008 without them ruling us completely. That is almost (and factually) entirely due to good God fearing Christains, almost entirely. If you replaced today's people with those Christians of even a mere 100 years ago we'd instantly slow their progress by another 100 years. Who else? Nortradamus, Strauss, Plato?...who else could you credit with keeping them at bay for this long? . And you would wonder at it's usefulness, it's relevance? New age 'thinkers' are fun.

For God's sake look to the source already. You can't keep ignoring it when everything about them and their ways was exposed for you a long time ago in that book.

Yes I will agree that book does lay claim as the original source of information on their ways.  So, what then?

Now you agree? Ok what then, then you must concede there is no way that was written by human hands, not for the insight and predictions it contains, not for the time it's been around. And if that's the case, how would you disregard the rest?   Like the guy interviewed as part of Mobes #4, 'the aliens wrote it'?  But only half the truth?
Frankly there is absolutely nothing worse for them than to have us revert to our respective faiths... why? Cause it's a fairy tale?  'What then?', I think that's answered. We grab hold of our previous and forgotten , neglected, strength in faith, and we use it to expose them and out them like previously done over 90 times in history by good Christians prior.

When everything about this conspiracy smacks of the supernatural and the religious (hell even the secular parts seem to borrow the symbology and language).

Ok, prove to use this whole conspiracy is simply related to supernatural and religious concepts.  Can you do this?  It is a part, but it is not "everything about this conspiracy" that "smacks of the supernatural and the religious".  It is more than that.  Have you been listening to the Off Tangent shows?  Are you rejecting certain information to validate your perceptions of the shows?  i.e. that the philosophy of creating the "utopian" society where humans are most effectively managed does not lay simply in "the supernatural and the religious" .i.e that the scientific rationality plays a huge part in the current machinations undertaken by our self-appointed masters.  Are you blocking these things out when you claim "the supernatural and the religious" are the "everything"?  All you need to do is go back and look at the shows Latin has made and there is ample exposure on the people behind such drives to control us in a rational nihilistic way, i.e. Charles Galton Darwin, Bertrand Russell, George Orwell, Aldous Huxley, and more.

Nope I'm seeing beyond 'certain information'. They will bring a world of scientific enslavement, As I've admitted before, but they will get there threw their dark master's guidance. And as I stated before this will be a dictatorship, well be lead by one who is totally soulless and who would be deeply entrenched in the dark arts. This 'utopia' is a misnomer however, this leader will be cruel beyond belief but his 'utopia' will not last.  
Also for proof? Look to the Kabala, look at the Talmud, look to 'six angles six lines six vertices', look to the Zorah, look to the Masonic lodge handbooks... look everywhere into that which is kept secret and you tell me there is no mystic (supernatural, witchcraft) symbology being used and practiced. Can you honestly do that?

You don't even have to believe in God and still that book is the best for understanding our enemy, at least all we need to know anyways.

Again, you claim it is all we need to know.  Alright.  Good for you.  That is all you need to know.  Move along.  Let us learn other things if we so choose to.  We already know the things in that book.  Why do you incessantly continue to repeat it?

You already know the things in that book? That's rich. And I incessantly continue to repeat it as it's been 'incessantly' ignored. It was brought up in the first place in retort to an insult, however it remains unchallenged, and whenever I try to elaborate on this position I'm attacked. So I repeat it , so that sooner or later you will understand its relevance, but so far it's escaping you. I have faith in you being big enough to look for yourself, and prove it wrong. But please post your results here for me too, as I said before I'd like to be able to dismiss this too. Going back to being an unbeliever is inviting to someone like me, but I can't unless I can lay to rest those original and tricky questions. I post here, apart from in response to an unfair blanket statement, in the hopes someone will address those points I've made. Believe it or not, I'm testing my theories on you, and they're still going strong. We still can't  HONESTLY dismiss it so easily (for better or worse) .

Where did the term 'Jew' come from? How about 'Israel'?

The term "Jew" did not come from Israel.  The term for an Israeli back in the day was Yisraelite.  The term "Jew" later emerged from applying the letter "J" in the place of the letter "Y" for the word Yudaean.  On a secondary note, "Jew" and "Jewish" are the improper noun and adjective derivations for the word Judean, properly they are Judaist and Judaic.  I only use those terms when referring to someone of Pentateuch of Tanakh religious following, but usually just use my quoted "Jew" to indicate the word is used incorrectly.  Just thought I would throw in that bit of info in this discussion about your post.  To continue on the word Yudean/Judean.  A Judean was properly a descendant of Judah, but over some time it was a person living in Judea who was either a Judean from Judahs lineage, a philosophical Judean, or simply living there.  With all the immigration and such it was hard to make the exclusive distinction, many meanings developed.  Also, it is claimed now amongst some scholars that Judean was later used as an outsider group name, while Israelite was used as an insider group name for those of Israel.

Again all biblical names.  And I never claimed the word 'Jew'  came from 'Israel' I was asking (slightly rhetorically) where both words originated from, and as you stated above they are derived from the same source I originally intended for you to realize. Even after that explanation you still do not have any reason for them being called 'Israelites' if not from God renaming Jacob, do you? Do your scholars?

Where was it first written not to practice usury and shun those that do?  Where is it first written that these people will use their oral law (the law of no effect) to eventually undermine all that is righteous? Is none of this panning out, right there in front of you? These examples are not alone, and nothing you put forward will ever top the understanding of the 'Talmudic Jew' that that book contains.

Who has denied this understanding of a Talmudic "Jew"?  Where did you get the impression we did not understand this?  I can only assume you repeat the obvious because you perceive us as not understanding this concept -> "Is none of this panning out, right there in front of you?".  There is plenty more evidence that goes into more detail than this one book.  There is plenty of evidence that needs to be known to show that the old "Jews" depicted in the Bible are sharing the same philosophy today.  You cannot limit your scope to that one book Gordzilla.  Do you comprehend why?  We need to look at current evidence of their behavior to show that they are currently acting that way.  You cannot limit the investigation to some group of people that were said to act a certain way two thousand years ago.  Good luck convincing anyone that today's "Jews" believe the same things if you only use the Bible to prove your point.  Do you understand why your limited claims of "all we need to know" about them is not sufficient?  Will you please stop claiming the Bible is all we need to read to understand them?  I hope I have illustrated this point.

"Who has denied this understanding of a Talmudic "Jew"?  " Ah, Latin for one (re- insulting blanket statements) And where did you get the impression it was the only book or source to use? Did I say that? I could've sworn I said 'best'  'most important' etc. But never 'only'. And still it is THE BEST as it's been PROVED to work in practice over 90 TIMES. DO you know something that works better? As for the rest of what you posted above, it's obviously flawed, it's only your perception of what you think I said and believe ... not what I do. (again you can do better than this, no?)

This is the 'elephant in the room' that Mutha was referring to. It's right in front of you guys, but it seems your media driven preconceptions of God is the hardest thing for you to drop.

That is very funny.  So now you claim our only problem with our perception of "God" comes from the media?  As if we haven't spent time looking into the issue ourselves?  How nice of you to assume such a straw man argument to attack.  Please continue...

Ok I will, the 'media' is everything from your music to your schools to everything you read and consumed right up and beyond your personal awaking ... everything. AND ALWAYS WITHOUT DOUBT THE ATTACK OF ALL THINGS 'GOD' WAS FIRST AND FORMOST ON THEIR AGENDA. EXPLAIN TO ME WHY'D THEY BOTHER IF IT'S A FAIRY TALE? OR IF THERE IS NOTHING WE CAN REDEM FOR OURSELVES IN THAT BOOK?.  A thorough belief in God has always proved to be a stumbling block for them. And within Muslim countries too. Please don't confuse this with modern church or religion, what are talking here is about true belief in God and His word and nothing else (in the religious spectrum).

So the most successful weapon ever used, and repeatedly I might add, to defeat these people will never by adopted by you guys out of nothing, nothing but bias? (as you still have no other way to explain away these facts ... don't worry- nor do I  and I didn't take lightly to the 'God' thing either. I was not born an alter boy and I still live in sin)

I'm glad you continued to attack the straw man.  No it isn't bias.  You claim we only have bias, yet you know nothing about our contemplation in the matter nor the road of inquiry we traveled to reach our conclusion.  You also claim we "have no other way to explain away these facts"... huh?  What facts are we explaining away?  The aforementioned information about Talmudic "Jews", usury, lies, deceit, murder?  When have we ignored such claims about those "Jews" that are like this?  Care to point these out?  Pretty much everyone on the forum is in agreement there are bad "Jews" out there who have such a mindset.  Or is there other information that you claim we are explaining "away" via our bias of "media driven preconceptions of God"? (again a false claim)

Your right, I don't know for you personally, for Latin and Canard I'm fairly certain it is bias. And what facts?  For the answer; again go back to the beginning. Your coming into this half way but Latin and others do know what I'm referring to.  Again not a false claim, but maybe for you ..but even that I still doubt... you are a dime a dozen you can't explain away my original points yet you still somehow know I'm wrong. If that's not just a bias then it seems your holding out, cause even within this post you've proved very little except that I don't personally know you.

Please, with all due respect, stop referring to us as 'you guys'. It should be 'us' and 'we'.  And also please stop speaking down to us, as if we can hardly follow these concepts.

As you have said, you have already looked into the "inner workings", and are clearly not interested in hearing Latin present such information, so when Latin says, "we", "us", "you" in trying to explain issues, he is not speaking to you as you do not consider yourself to be included in such a grouping.  If you were interested in Latin's topic of discussion, he is referring to me and everyone who is listening as people who likely have not heard this information before, and since he already knows it, it wouldn't be correct to include himself in addressing new information. Latin has used collective words before to express a collective understanding of the information presented at TIU to build upon an understanding we all have and then present his new information, sometimes in analogous forms.  Stop being so touchy dude.  You seem to want to pick at any little thing said to bring down the validity of the usefulness of his shows.  I think you have already brought up this lame claim in a previous comment.  You are insulted by your perception that Latin is speaking down to you?  Stop listening...

Not the first time such language was used and I'm trying to get him to reconsider his delivery, he should - and I'm not the only one who perceives him  to sound a little conceited. Touchy? Well maybe, but this forum should be about truth, not promoting theories, and especially not theories that, as we are repeatedly reminded,  are very huge concepts hard to follow and conceptualize. Why? Cause there IS NEVER truth in extreme complication, is it their tool not ours. They notoriously use complexity to hide their blatantly evil practices from us. From their banking practices to how they explain away why they need a 25 foot concrete wall around their cuntry[SIC]. But it is the truth that they always have to pile these complexities on. It's hidden in this camouflage. Usury is usury, but to them it's 'interest compacted bi-annually and subtracted from your income at a rate of a precontrived inflation to mirror the rising cost of re-creating these moneys to further help in continuing to provide the general public with relief in ways only a government can' .... Or something along those lines ...of course their explanations need lawyers to decipher. The truth is ALWAYS dead simple.

We are ALL in this together.

Yes, so how about you act like it and focus on real issues rather than attempting to deconstruct the validity of the Off Tangent material.  I made several comments above why this info is important, maybe now you will see it as well.

Why is it you feel what you provided here is important and what I did is not, especially considering yours is easily deconstructed and mine remains solid? Or that I might not understand it? Perhaps it is you who fails to understand?  My points remain the same and unchallenged, I do no need to do interviews or make radio shows to prove them either. Though I like Latin's abilities, I do not like him working on theories that I can easily dismiss as flawed, if I'm proven wrong then fine I'll concede it  but so far that has not happened.  Speak the truth and I have no problem, that's what we're all 'in together' on. ... right?.. ..getting to the truth? So deconstruct my original points or dispute Latin as his points are now flawed if mine stand - do one or the other. Truth rules, feelings be damned.

I'm only using this to humble you a little.    To 'keep your feet on the ground',  'keep it real' - so to speak.

I submit you need to float down off the religious cloud and start respecting other peoples choice of material they want to discuss and listen to, when it isn't derived or focused on the Bible as a source of information.

'the religious cloud' you sure there's no bias in you? If Alex Jones talks crap you can easily dispute, you still respect it? The point –yet again – was brought up by Latin and again I'm helping this movement by encouraging those to look there (and not only there) for the best source of understanding their character. I am starting to think you really don't get it.  And who am I not respecting? Cause I challenge Latin that means I'm not respecting him? Did you happen to hear what he called people like me? I haven't resorted to name calling, I may be crude in my point making, but again feelings be damned ..this is the pursuit of truth and it goes wherever it leads guided ONLY by that which can be proved to be true, and by working theories which cannot be disproven. This is not solely the bible, but it certainly is the best source for a true understanding of their character, it is also the first, and by such a huge margin of time that it is nothing short of  astonishing. As well as containing some predictions that have beard fruit, and again from a long time ago. These insights are not human, nor could they be. This makes anyone who thinks critically wonder just how much else of that book contains truth? When did you honestly 'read' it last, and fully? If you haven't since you awoke you may wish to revisit it. It'll help you understand why you don't need to know how they're doing it, you only need to know 'who' and how to readily indentify them. Its analogous to you finding your love one dead, heaven forbid, and you want to know how it was done rather than by who,  -honestly what would be your first question?  That book provides us with who and how to identify them, better than anything and still even today. If fact; go around preaching Jesus and His 'message to the Pharisees' and they will instantly be on your doorstep, they are not on Latin's yet, but if he, hypothetically, changed his tune and started talking about what Jesus has to say about them, how to recognize them etc etc ...well  this would get them to his door much faster..then he'd  become really dangerous to them But why?

Exploring the intricacies of their deception, is like counting the corn in someone's shit. Instead just point out the culprit for the rest of us and then start the cleaning! We can deal with the shit distributers after they are fully identified.

You can point all you want, but no one is going to move unless they are convinced of the factual validity of the claims being made.  The Bible is NOT going to cut it!  Does that make sense?  Hence the need to uncover the actuality behind what has been happening, which you seem very little concerned about. Judging from your posts it gives that impression, maybe I'm not understanding your claims in the way you intended to present them... sorry if that is the case.

Perhaps you are right on this point, the bible won't cut it, because to most the perception of message it contains  came from the media and the prevailing corrupted church. But if we in this movement used the book (and no church) to illustrate what their up to , and why as well -and even what's to come ...well then yeah the bible would cut it. However unfortunately its image has long since been smeared for most (and I still suspect you to be one of the 'most' as well) , first you have to get threw that, that takes much effort , to which I can contest, but once done the book reads way differently, like I said; try it out now, now after you are awake. I admit here at this forum , apart from Mutha and a few others I am alone on this, but this is not the case in the movement of which we are a part of. This is why I do critique Latin, as he seems to want to steer away from that and offer new explanations to an ancient and already explained phenomenon. Do you understand that?

This puts, in my opinion anyways, the onus on them to prove their innocence and on an individual scale -although I have a feeling this will later be done for us.  Till then it's quite obvious that none should be trusted until proven to be trustworthy, none!

Yup, a lot of us understand this too  A lot of them have proven to be trustworthy, ask Og, he has a good friend he can vouch for.

Never said it was impossible, I think this is one point we can agree on then.

Know your enemy, care not about his method, just expose him in its fallacy.

As I stated early on in this discourse, that is one of the goals of uncovering the details, to better know, to better understand, to better identify.  It isn't the "Jews" only, Gordy... you need to practice what you preach and look at the fallacies in what you are saying.  "Who gives a f@ck?" ... "Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it?".  These statements were uses to belittle the validity of the current Off Tangent, that you do not agree with the reasons for talking about such things.  You seem to fail to see why the shows apply to knowing the enemy, and that is, all of the enemy, not just one particular group.

Nope but if Talmudic Jews are identified and removed from the equation the poisoned waters slowly clear, the 'good' start to prevail as before. Those deceived into doing [i[their[/i] bidding are exposed and/or freed. You remove the weed at the root, the damaged areas around the weed repair themselves. This is the point, they are the influence that makes ANYBODY who would act against the better judgment of their conscious to actually do so.  Without their influence, especially since it became world-wide and mainstream, what sins did we fall prey too, and how often? Well let's look ...just go back 100 years about the time their mainstream pollution machine really started getting off the ground. Back then statistically and generally there were;
More marriages that lasted.
Less random shootings, even though guns were more readily available.
Less crime, especially personal thievery, except during the times they were busy crashing the economy.
More respect for one's fellow man, even fighting had more honor, you fought 'mano to mano', either in a fist fight or duel.
More respect for one's own and others environment and property.
More integrity to be found in your average Joe, they actually volunteered to fight in the wars as they felt what they were being told was true and the war was about good and evil...now although they try to use the same lines, most people are not clamoring to join the 'honorable' fight.
Children respected their elders, and were in fact called 'Children' and not baby goats.
Do we really need to go on? I guess we should include at least one more point on this;
The Talmudic Jew had fewer places to hide.
How did they get us to turn our backs on such traditions, morals and common decency? First and foremost by removing the Christian identify, trivializing it and segregating it... diluting it into the 'Hagee Gideon' crap we have today. Enough so that the 'intelligent' will likely, especially with all the new 'facts' of evolution and the promotion of science (thru the roof), disbelieve in a God, and the ignorant will follow a version of 'god' that they have contrived. In which,  of course, they are the chosen people and this had nothing to do with an covenant, or deal made with God prior (which they violated), no rather that; 'it is just so and anyone who doesn't believe it is an enemy of God'.

Or , figure out their inner structure, the historical way these structures always come into being etc. Then what?   ... Oh yeah, back to praying!

What?  That doesn't make sense?  Go back to praying?  Maybe you would... but we sure as hell won't!  No time for praying to some being that may or may not exist.. wtf has that thing ever done for you or anyone else that you can prove?  Or is it that you believe "Gods" hand will help you?  Or has helped anyone?  Or will help us fight the enemy?  We are the only ones who can do it!

It's an illustration of how the first option of trying to figure out the inner structure, the history etc will help in no way,  - and it won't.  For what's to come , as stated above that quote of mine (in the rest of its context!) , would be bloody and devastating, either way you will end up praying. Hardly ever an atheist in a foxhole  - so to speak.

P.S.S. Hope you do not try to prove the 'ruling class' is anything but the Kabalistic Talmudic Jew, you will have an uphill battle on that issue if you do.

Sure we can agree the Talmudic "Jews" play a crucial role in our current affairs.  Have they always held this position?  No.  If you say yes, prove that they have always been the "ruling class".  That will be something I would like to see.  Those who fail to understand history and doomed to repeat it, or something like that.  There is more than just the "Jewish" history to learn about Gordzila.  It all ties in together.  I hope you can come to realize that.
Peace.

What you missed is the part when I explained how history repeats? Did you not notice how I mentioned we wake to them, kick them out then go back to sleep and they start up the process again? Or how they have to pirate power from us to begin with, always underhandedly. This would indicate; no they are not always the 'ruling class' (never my term to begin with but fine) , but they always try to be and occasionally succeed for a limited time. However, again, this time it's for the grand prize... the whole planet... they've never quite made it to this level before, this is new.  It all ties together, but it is YOU  who needs to come to realize that. I already use other material, all about masons and many other aspects of the social disease, you however leave out the most telling and important piece... as proven to you time and again... so who's not looking at the whole picture?  My points fit every piece of the puzzle and are historically accurate, hell even your grandparents may have sat around the dinner table and had no qualms about calling a Jew a Jew, what have we lost since then, and what have gained?

-Gord

[LatinAmericanview]

What you missed is the part when I explained how history repeats?

How would you begin to study that pattern?  What would be the method?

[GordZilla]

What you missed is the part when I explained how history repeats?

How would you begin to study that pattern?  What would be the method?

Hi Latin,

 First thanks for weighing in.

How would I study the pattern? Not sure I'd spend the time doing that at all. Only know that the spread of Christianity (even Islam for that matter) is by far the best, and proven, method for outing these bastards. The pattern has already been explained by me, albeit briefly and simply, it is none-the-less been 'studied'.

Pattern;

Good Christians live peacefully as serfs of their respective states, yes the ruling class is not (at this point) a completely innocent and benevolent one – they will invoke taxes, maybe start unjust persecutions etc., however for the most part there is peace on the land.

Talmudic Jews slowly integrate themselves into the landscape, as always 'secretively' at first until their teeth are set into the skin of the current ruling class. Until the current ruling class, monarchy what have you, becomes indebted to them –threw whatever underhanded means; blackmail, usury etc.

The current ruling class than increases their tyranny on its peoples to help collect wealth to repay their newly occurred debt. Often this causes distaste even within the publically perceived ruling class themselves (often 'good' kings wanted to remain that way, but their hand got forced).

The ignorant, but God's law obeying, serfs start to feel the pressure of higher and unjust taxation. 'Ignorant' maybe in banking practices, but not ignorant in just and unjust actions (thanks to their faith), the serfs become slowly more and more discontented.

They unite under the banner of their faith and rebel, or put pressure on their ruling class, or riot outright –until legislation and/or physical action removes the parasite from their lands.

Then back to sleep they go, peacefully once again ... until the Talmudic Jew returns. Then the cycle repeats.

The world can be seen as a bushel of fruit, ripe and clean. The Talmudic Jew can be seen as the parasite who slowly rots this fruit from within. In the past we could throw out the pieces of fruit that were fully infected with the parasite and still spare the remainder. This time around the whole bushel is infected, and the fruits defenses, it's skin, has been weekend sufficiently enough that the spread of their disease is done almost effortlessly - it's done for them. This time around we can't just separate the spoiled fruit from the rest, this time around it is the whole bushel that must be tossed and we must restart completely with a new seed. A seed still crafted from the old plant, but untouched (for now) by the parasite.  

Our best hope is to keep those new 'seeds for the future' knowledgeable about the past, to have them ready to recognize the parasite when it re-emerges (as it always does).

To them this is the part they have yet to destroy, this very seed of knowledge of who they really are. This is the part they fear the most, that one of those seeds might get by their radar and re-ignite the spark of knowledge that will eventually and yet again lead to the discovering of their parasitical ways.

And who or what do they see as this seed? As this big threat to exposing them once again?

Science? No.
Philosophy (even radical philosophy)? No.
Arts? No.

You can talk to your blue in the face about intergovernmental or ruling class philosophy or structure and they would care not. You, to them,  do not carry the seed to their demise. Nope, the answer is simple (and proven) yet again.

Christian ideology! you bet'cha!

For someone like you to survive and speak up after they enact their incredibly brutal culling on the human race would matter little to them. You are toothless to them. For someone who knows the bible, and can speak of Jesus and His words and warnings ...well that person is precisely who  MUST go, that person becomes the real danger to them. This is so obvious it hurts. They are loving the fact that their greatest enemy, the faithful, have all but disappeared, to them it's as though the protective skin has been removed from the fruit entirely and they can dive right in and start the degradation, no 'watch dogs' left, is an ideal world for them. And all though you may be on a pedestal, trying to explain their actions and evils to a yet not awake bunch of fruit, you are still no bother to them. They would worry more about letting just one homeless man who stands on a milk crate and preaches the word of Jesus escape, than an army of people who share your views. This is very telling and it is the truth of the matter. Your explanations and theories, although well presented, thought out etc. is the stuff of a college's philosophy program. It's not at all the material needed to insight revolution and unification. It is in essence, no plan, no defense, just speculation and endless and needless description. Jesus' plan exposes them, it  insights revolution and defense, it insights righteousness and goodwill, it insights unification and a healthy and strong bushel of fruit. Which do you think our 'favorite' parasite is more likely to concern themselves with destroying? Your views, or a God fearing Christians'? I think the answer to this is already laid out there for you in spades. Shown time and time again, religion and especially Christianity is their first and foremost target, Jesus is their most hated. He is the spoiler of parasites, as they are the spoilers of good fruit.

 You may not see truth in this, it may elude you even still, but it's in the pudding. They have spent countless hours and resources defaming and smearing Christianity with vigor and purpose. Why? Why the effort? And it's worked almost entirely, even as you may not recognize it, maybe your parents don't either but how far back in your own family tree do you have to go to find a Christian? (assuming you're from a Christian heritage, but in other religions the anology still works -somewhat) Not far I imagine, and for most 'Christians' (practicing or not) this is the case. They destroyed our ancestor's ideology, to the point now where belief in God is virtually laughable to the likes of you, do you think your elders would approve? This is the real 'dumbing down' that was needed to be first installed world-wide to make the fruit soft and ready for infestation. For them, even one Christian surviving their onslaught is one too many, however a million conspiracy philosophers and theorists would hardly be concerning to them. Without the word of God, your direction will never quite nail them down nor bring justice to them and they know it. After all, what's your plan? Bring them to court? Insight revolution with no unifying platform? (which you could never obtain, as theories have no real unification value ...as we'll always all have our own) .

 This is a nature of what we are dealing with, hands down their greatest fear is a revival of Christian faith,  morals and dogma. This is extremely detrimental to them. Which is yet another reason for how I know this shit is spot on. As long as you're talking about nothing, and inciting no revolution, no retaliatory action then why would they even concern themselves with you? The faith in Jesus, however, has brought revolution and retaliatory action to their doorstep time and time again..

It is our best tool for fighting them. A truth they also recognize and a truth also proven historically.

Is more still needed, or are you starting to understand this?

-Gord

P.S. again, by 'Christain' I mean 'bible only' believing and God fearing ones, and not the 'churchies' we are so often confused with.

"  'A generation's always dumber than its parents' - came crashing thru the window" –The Tragically Hip

[LatinAmericanview]

What you missed is the part when I explained how history repeats?

How would you begin to study that pattern?  What would be the method?.

Hi Latin,

 First thanks for weighing in.

How would I study the pattern? Not sure I'd spend the time doing that at all. Only know that the spread of Christianity (even Islam for that matter) is by far the best, and proven, method for outing these bastards. The pattern has already been explained by me, albeit briefly and simply, it is none-the-less been 'studied'.

 Has it ever occurred to you that these are opposing power groups?  Moreover, It seems that your ethno-centric view does not address various positions that reject imperialism and religious conquest. I am ameri-indian- Christianity is not our not natural religion. I only mention this because you seem to be OK WITH SERFDOM AS LONG AS THE RULERS ARE CHRISTIAN!  It is precisouly these conditions that create disaffection among the subject classes leading to revolution where Jews have take the reigns and lead us all down the primrose path.

Pattern;

Good Christians live peacefully as serfs of their respective states, yes the ruling class is not (at this point) a completely innocent and benevolent one – they will invoke taxes, maybe start unjust persecutions etc., however for the most part there is peace on the land.

In your own words.

Talmudic Jews slowly integrate themselves into the landscape, as always 'secretively' at first until their teeth are set into the skin of the current ruling class. Until the current ruling class, monarchy what have you, becomes indebted to them –threw whatever underhanded means; blackmail, usury etc.

 Yes then usually they get the masses to attack their masters only to replace them with Jewish masters.  In short the masses always have to have some sor of masses. Why do you think that is?

The current ruling class than increases their tyranny on its peoples to help collect wealth to repay their newly occurred debt. Often this causes distaste even within the publically perceived ruling class themselves (often 'good' kings wanted to remain that way, but their hand got forced).

I think it is a whole lot more complicated then that. I have not been able to do as much research needed to make a show on this topic.

The ignorant, but God's law obeying, serfs start to feel the pressure of higher and unjust taxation. 'Ignorant' maybe in banking practices, but not ignorant in just and unjust actions (thanks to their faith), the serfs become slowly more and more discontented.
Cant this this better explained by social engineering techniques. Unfortunately it involves science. It certian seems like the current ruling class has turn to this model in addition to their Talmudic ways.  Why do you think that Jews have turned to science to help implement their evil plan.  (Please say evil- in DR. Evil voice)

They unite under the banner of their faith and rebel, or put pressure on their ruling class, or riot outright –until legislation and/or physical action removes the parasite from their lands.

Securing the help of the superstitious masses is the most effective way of forcing change.

Then back to sleep they go, peacefully once again ... until the Talmudic Jew returns. Then the cycle repeats.

The world can be seen as a bushel of fruit, ripe and clean. The Talmudic Jew can be seen as the parasite who slowly rots this fruit from within. In the past we could throw out the pieces of fruit that were fully infected with the parasite and still spare the remainder. This time around the whole bushel is infected, and the fruits defenses, it's skin, has been weekend sufficiently enough that the spread of their disease is done almost effortlessly - it's done for them. This time around we can't just separate the spoiled fruit from the rest, this time around it is the whole bushel that must be tossed and we must restart completely with a new seed. A seed still crafted from the old plant, but untouched (for now) by the parasite.  

Wordy and really does nothing to further our understanding.

Our best hope is to keep those new 'seeds for the future' knowledgeable about the past, to have them ready to recognize the parasite when it re-emerges (as it always does).

To them this is the part they have yet to destroy, this very seed of knowledge of who they really are. This is the part they fear the most, that one of those seeds might get by their radar and re-ignite the spark of knowledge that will eventually and yet again lead to the discovering of their parasitical ways.

And who or what do they see as this seed? As this big threat to exposing them once again?

Science? No.
Philosophy (even radical philosophy)? No.
Arts? No.

I guess what you are saying is that only religion can really explain what is going on? How does the religious tradition explain the scientific implementation of tyranny?

You can talk to your blue in the face about intergovernmental or ruling class philosophy or structure and they would care not. You, to them,  do not carry the seed to their demise. Nope, the answer is simple (and proven) yet again.

Christian ideology! you bet'cha!

[/quote][/quote] Prove it!

.These were just a few questions that I have.

Cheers
Latin

[Anonymous]

a challenge still left uncontested

You created a challenge that the Bible is all we need, which is false, and I explained why.  If your challenge was that the Bible talks about them, we all know it does.  And I already said there is more info we need that just the Bible.

"You don't even have to believe in God and still that book is the best for understanding our enemy, at least all we need to know anyways."

All we need to know to understand our enemy is in the one book that best describes them.  That is what you say.  By continually repeating it is the best, the most important to understand them, it implies we do not need another source to understand them.  "all we need to know" says it all.  The words you use have certain meaning when used together.  If this was not the intention you wanted to give, you need to revise the use of words and properly use accurate words to describe what you are intending to say.  Just look at the sentence, it says implicitly that it is the best, most important book to use to know "all we need to know" about the enemy.  It is not all we need to know about them.

By continuing to say we are not using that source in our evidence, you are negating the explanations I have given and will give (explanations you may not have thought of) as to why it is not a good source to use given our lack of indoctrination in accepting the book as accurate in all matters, and how it is DEFINITELY NOT the most important or best source to use given this lack of indoctrination into the faith based belief system that others have who we are trying to explain the problem to.  Use it if you want to.  We choose not to.  Stop concluding we can't disprove it, can't debunk it, are flawed, etc, just because we choose not to use it for them any reasons I have illustrated in this and my previous post.

Just a little out of context, no? (you can do better than this) I was saying who gives a fuck about the intricacies .

Misconstruing what I said, as I plainly said this is what you don't care about, so if you don't care about the intricacies, move the hell along and go do something else with your time other than criticize the validity of shows based on your understanding that these topics are not important.  Thanks for the input.  But move onto something more productive.

However to address your question There is no 'more significant evidence', there is no better tool to use in this fight, I can't imagine any better way to know your enemy either.

There IS more significant evidence.  I already covered why we need to look at the evidence of today more than the evidence of two thousand years ago.  Go back and read.

Than debunk it. Address the point.

No one claimed there wasn't evidence of them in the past, in the Bible, yet you keep creating that straw man and try to use that delusional creation to take down the information presented as if that one literary work is the only thing that matter.  Like I said, it's a flawed tool to use as the "best", "most important" evidence needed, which you incessantly claim it is.

See above and earlier posts, already provided more than you can answer.

Well there is more than I care to answer, because it's all repetition about how your wonderful book is the only thing that is needed to understand them.  Move along, get off your delusion of one book has the only answer we need (read above to see why that is how you are expression your position).  I already covered this, read the post where I talk about the need to use other information that describes how they are currently and how a book based on fables, myth, stories, history and supernatural does NOT cut it as the primary source of info you use!  It's flawed, delusional and ignorant to expect people to believe you when you use only the Bible.  How can you not understand this and keep repeating your same old tired line?

I've explained how we can know it's the Talmudic Jew behind it all. Others are mislead , perhaps by greed, perhaps by other things, but the root ..the source ..the original deception comes from?

By reading the Bible?  It will tell us everything?  How they were in control of Rome?  How they were in control of Greece?  How they were in control of Persia?  Of Babylon?  Of Assyria?  Or any other empire on earth in our real or fabricated history?  You make assumption after assumption, and simply say, "well it's in the Bible, but you guy's keep ignoring it, you can't refute it, you can't debunk it".  Get off your brainwashed "Bible has all the answers to everything we need to know" horse and understand that you may like to only have one source and believe in the superstitious angry, vengeful, hateful fraudulent YHWH that is NOT the god of the NT, but we don't, and so stop trying to push us into accepted the authority of a book written by a bunch of people long ago as the primary, best, most important source of info we need.

I am exposing the history behind it, and the ideology about how we got where we are.

No, you are using one source, the Bible, and continually refuting any merit in the investigation we are interested in.  How blind do you have to be?  You cannot use one source and proclaim it to be the "best", "most important" "all we need to know" source on them.  You are using your faith in this "God" extrapolating it to the events in history based on faith, and further using faith to proclaim the only evidence we need is from the Bible.  So no you are not exposing the history, you are exposing ONE PART of the history, not all of it.  This was the point I made several times in my last post.  Go read it again. To understand if indeed it is truly some bad evil "Jews" that created the original philosophy and were there to further add onto it, and create the conflicts, and have a hand in everything bad through history, you need to look at other things than just the one source called the Bible.  Why this concept has failed to make an impact in your response, even though I stated it several times, is beyond me.  To use your funny phrase: "Hello? Is this thing on? You hear yourself?".  This is an effort to tie everything in history together, which you have stated several times you don't see as something needed.  Good for you.

You, Latin, Canard, cannot rebuke my points but know I'm wrong.

Rebuke your points?  About what?  The "Jews"?  Why would we need to?  Have we ever gone against your point that Bible talks about the "Jews" and how they were?  No.  So again, straw man invention that we cannot rebuke your point that we didn't say was wrong, yet you continue to claim the opposite. You need to stop imposing your perception of how we udnerstand things simply because we have not previously addressed you long drawn out posts about how the Bible is the only source we need.  I finally did because I am getting really sick of it, and I explained several items, why you cannot use ONE SOURCE as the crux for a case against them.  The best evidence is what is gong on right now, not 2000 years ago man!  It is only usefull to show how many have remained largely in the same tribal-cultural hateful mentality.

if its about God it can't be right, cause frankly even still you have nothing to counter my original points.

As I have stated I will not go into a theological debate, because you cannot prove it and I cannot disprove it using any evidence.  IT IS A FAITH.  IT IS A BELIEF.  THIS IS NOT A DISCUSSION FORUM FOR FAITHS AND BELIEFS.  It only serves to disunite our common goal.  Your problem is that you think everyone needs to accept the Bible as the only source needed to know the enemy.  Well it isn't!  So stop bringing in your accusation that we fail to address your theological points in your posts, because you should NOT have introduced them in the first place.

because I don't feel, at all,that Latin is "interested in exposing the history behind the ideology of how we got to where we are" If he was he'd have to at least consider what he can not readily write off.

From a perspective of using accurate sources, the Bible is not a good one to use.  It is TAINTED with other things that cannot be proven, that are based on believing them as fact, when there is no corroborating evidence in other times, our times, to substantiate the superstitious faith based content.  If there was a "God" now that decided to speak to us, and guide as is claimed in the Bible, then there would be reason for people to accept the accounts in the Bible as actually having happened.  Otherwise, it is faith.  It is belief.  And to use a source with such non-critical information by picking the part about the "Jews" and only using that "best" source, is ridiculous.  People would simply laugh at you if you explained your argument about the "Jews" using only that "best" source as "all we need" to understand them.  So I laid it out again why the Bible is not good enough alone.  Do you get it this time?  Use it in conjunction with other material to prove that that one aspect about describing their ways is accurate, but other than that there is no evidence to prove the supernatural superstitious claims that so many adhere to simply on faith and belief.

It makes you uncomfortable I know, me too, but it cannot be dismissed and especially by one you claim to be about "exposing the history behind the ideology" etc.

It is tainted with other bogus shite.  You don't think it's shite because you adhere to those concepts simply on faith and belief.  Other people don't accept simple faith and belief to validate a historical aspect that is so convoluted in other material that cannot be substantiated.  Yes it is accurate in that ONE aspect (and surely others, but for this argument we are talking about that one part in particular), but again, stop using it as the be all end all of the information we need to know them.  I have shown you why this is so - in the last post and this one again.  You claim to be about exposing history... how about using other sources than the one that is not a proper historical source to use -> the bible?   How about that?  If you cannot yet see why using one source and claim it to be the "best", "most important" "all we need to know" source on them is flawed, how there IS merit in the Off Tangent shows going into the intricacies of the history behind it all, then you are a hopeless cause.  Why don't we use the Bible as our crux?  Because it is tainted in superstitious fabrications to us.  You want to believe it, go for it!  Use rationality you want to accept it, it makes sense for you, great, glad to hear it!  Stop trying to claim it is true but we fail to accept it because we cannot address your theological "proof".  It is rationalizing something that cannot be proven.  Contemplation, thought, not factual evidentiary proof.

To 'know' thy enemy is not to know their modus operandi but rather to know their nature, they do not change their spots , they've been like this since day one

Your definition is to only know their nature, we choose another definition to know them, ok?  And no, they aren't all like this from day one, these bad ones have evolved and adapted to new mechanisms of evil.

Do we? Good question. In light of knowing, quite obviously (and Ognir seems to know this too), that Talmudic Jews are at the top, why then are we gonna explain how there may be other hidden 'ruling classes'? You sure we don't?

I am not sure.  That is the whole point of going into detail to be sure.  But you seem to not care about "intricacies" and are content using the one source to explain everything.  So leave us be in what you perceive to be our ignorance and let us go down a different path that you do not agree with.  Why the need to impose your perspective on us while claiming ours is "flawed"?  Get your head out of your ass.  I have not tried to tell others, such as the people on Khanverse's forum, how they are "wrong" in the choice of information they are talking about?  And I won't, it is not my place to tell them what to do when trying to uncover aspects of the conspiracy.  To each our own

It's deception and illusion practiced on an unsuspecting people, like tricking a child....oh you're so smart. 'Candy from a baby' for them. For us, 'it's wrong to take candy from a baby'. Who is more intelligent?

Yes it is all of that.  But you are using your own definition of intelligence to polarize it into a good vs evil definition, where doing evil negates the possibility of it being intelligent.  Do you want to argue with a dictionary?

1 a (1) : the ability to learn or understand or to deal with new or trying situations  : REASON;  also   : the skilled use of reason  (2) : the ability to apply knowledge to manipulate one's environment or to think abstractly as measured by objective criteria (as tests)

Again, the points I made earlier cover all you posted above, but simply put if you can't disprove them, then there is truth to this book (and that is flipping obvious) and therefore you may just have to take all of it for truth, AS AGAIN you have now way to debunk what I put to Latin much earlier.

Assuming something is true because one thing can be proven to be true is a great big fallacy.  I'll write a book, and in that book I'll but some truths and some lies.  According to you the fabricated lies would be true because there is truth that you can plainly see and corroborate, while the other information you cannot, but you will accept it as truth based on faith that it is true.  This is your rationality when it comes to the rest of the things in the Bible.  This tactic is used by dissinfo agents, shills, gatekeepres, and the like.  Also another tactic, is to make your lies very appealing to those you are trying to indoctrinate into accepting it by playing on some human frailty, such as desires to believe it to be true, fear of something, etc.  People have looked at the literary tool used in the Bible and have implemented it in other works to trick and deceive others into accepting their works.  This is to illustrate how literary fiction can be used.  Not to say it is an absolute fact that it is lies.

Yes their is plenty of "truth". What is factual and what is invented?  Can you prove the invented non corroborated evidentiary "truths" are indeed actual truths or are merely fabricated lies?  So you cannot, but continue to assert they are "absolute" because they are "truths" as you udnerstand them.  Continue to claim we cannot disprove the theological concepts, but you cannot prove them either, other that conceptual rationalization where faith and belief are used to assert the absolute fact of the matter.  I can only assume you are talking about theological claims you made, as anyone can see the correlating "truth" between actions of some "Jews" today, in the past, and in biblical times, and we never negated this "truth", but you assume we did.  I even admitted this is evident in the last post, which you quoted in making the response I have just quoted.  So it leaves me to conclude that you are now referring to the theological aspect of your perception of "truth".

I do not pick and choose, I believe the whole word. Scares the crap out of me to as He is a hard ass. And until you can actually prove against my earlier points than yeah that proves it's authentic.

Accepting something as true, based on other information that is also presented that can be corroborated, is not proving the other info true, as stated above why this is a fallacious reasoning tactic.  The theological aspect cannot be disproven, nor can it be proven.  Which is why we shouldn't be debating them and using them as a basis in arguing the validity of the "Jewish" identity .  How you fail to see the merit in separating the two is beyond me at this point.  Faith, belief of the whole Bible does not constitute proof of the whole Bible as fact and as of actually having taken place based on evidence.  It is a logical fallacy to consider it otherwise.  Believe what you want, don't start proclaiming it as FACT based on EVIDENCE when there isn't any just because some parts do have such proof.  Fallacy of accepting all info just because some is true.  Tactic of the dissinfo agent who mixed lies and truth to sucker you into their frame work of how something happened.

If you replaced today's people with those Christians of even a mere 100 years ago we'd instantly slow their progress by another 100 years.

Yup, indoctrination is a useful tool.

Who else? Nortradamus, Strauss, Plato?...who else could you credit with keeping them at bay for this long?

Ok, now you are just being silly.  What an irrational statement.  Those people are doing the opposite, and for you claim we think they have been helping us keep them at bay is such a lie that would either indicate you have not understood what Off Tangent shows are attempting to illustrate when discussion those characters, or that you are intentionally acting in a delusional way to impose another straw man argument onto us to discredit the validity of the work being undertaken.

Now you agree? Ok what then, then you must concede there is no way that was written by human hands, not for the insight and predictions it contains, not for the time it's been around. And if that's the case, how would you disregard the rest? Like the guy interviewed as part of Mobes #4, 'the aliens wrote it'? But only half the truth?

No way it was written by human hands?  LMAO.  You're a riot of assumptions raging towards the finish line of "God" exists because he wrote it.

Humans wrote it.

Your first assumption is the human back then didn't have the "insight" capable to write it.  How the hell do you know that?  Fallacy.

Your second assumptions is that the "predictions" apply to our time right now.  By looking at patterns in the past, the future can be predicted to a certain extent given that no finite or extremely precise details are give.  These events can be seen in various points in history because the vague assertions about the future predictions are not absolutely specific in detail to pin point one particular event.  They are created to be ambiguous and interpretive enough to be applied over and over so that gullible believers will see their time as the time "predicted" in this book.  It is a masterfully created literary work created by very brilliant men of the time.  You assume they were not capable because you have another faith based prejudicial belief that negates this possibility from explaining the way it was written.  So long as you continue to blindly adhere to your belief, you continue to reject other explanations that are more plausible, since they are not rooted in your assumption that a great being is the only one to possibly have such insight and "predictive" abilities.

The second part about aliens, please do not attribute such polarized belief for people to accept, that either it was written by a god or it was written by aliens.  There are more logical reasons to explain how the Bible was written.  Maybe you have not come across authors who present rational explanations for the literary style used in creating bible lore.

Frankly there is absolutely nothing worse for them than to have us revert to our respective faiths... why? Cause it's a fairy tale? 'What then?', I think that's answered. We grab hold of our previous and forgotten , neglected, strength in faith, and we use it to expose them and out them like previously done over 90 times in history by good Christians prior.

Yes faith is very useful in such cases.  It uses indoctrinated dogma to shape the mind of the believer into accepting only what is taught to them.  Look at the religious "Jews", they are still bitches to the Judaic teachings.  If we were all bitches to the Bible then we would all have the similar indoctrination that would prevent us from accepting changes that have been imposed on us.  The elimination of religious control enabled us to become so fucked.  I still prefer to think for myself than to be indoctrinated.  If more people used their reason and logic to look at whether changes were good or bad, then we would not be here.  There is much value in the Christian NT teachings, they should not have been thrown away.  Did you know we feel this way?  Latin, Canard do.  You possibly assumed that we didn't?  I don't know what you thought, but now you know.

Also for proof? Look to the Kabala, look at the Talmud, look to 'six angles six lines six vertices', look to the Zorah, look to the Masonic lodge handbooks... look everywhere into that which is kept secret and you tell me there is no mystic (supernatural, witchcraft) symbology being used and practiced. Can you honestly do that?

I said -> "It is a part, but it is not "everything about this conspiracy" that "smacks of the supernatural and the religious". It is more than that."

I guess you do only read and interpret things they way you want to, without actually reading what someone says...

You already know the things in that book? That's rich. And I incessantly continue to repeat it as it's been 'incessantly' ignored. It was brought up in the first place in retort to an insult, however it remains unchallenged, and whenever I try to elaborate on this position I'm attacked. So I repeat it , so that sooner or later you will understand its relevance, but so far it's escaping you. I have faith in you being big enough to look for yourself, and prove it wrong. But please post your results here for me too, as I said before I'd like to be able to dismiss this too. Going back to being an unbeliever is inviting to someone like me, but I can't unless I can lay to rest those original and tricky questions. I post here, apart from in response to an unfair blanket statement, in the hopes someone will address those points I've made. Believe it or not, I'm testing my theories on you, and they're still going strong. We still can't HONESTLY dismiss it so easily (for better or worse) .

We have to explain our own rationalized conclusions to you vs your own rationalized conclusions for you to not be a believer anymore?  Why do I care?  Believe what you want.  You think I'm going to go dig up all the things that brought me to my current understanding just to prove it to you? The work is out there, if you are so wanting to change your understanding of the issue, go do your own research on the theological superstitious faith belief you have.  This is not the place for that, just as I said in response to mutha.  I am not interested in making you change your stance on your beliefs.  The problem lays with you asserting they are true, extrapolating that assertion of your faith to conclude the Bible is the source we need to focus on.  We choose other sources.  You want to stick with your Bible as your crux in your arguments, go for it.  I have explained why this is a weak tactic to convince people, unless they are also indoctrinated or adhere in the belief system you do.

"Who has denied this understanding of a Talmudic "Jew"? " Ah, Latin for one (re- insulting blanket statements)

The Bible is not the proper tool.. Get that through your head.  If we were all Christian, sure it would be.  But we aren't.  Where did Latin say the Bible does not show any understanding of the Talmudic "Jew"?  I would like to hear this.

And where did you get the impression it was the only book or source to use? Did I say that? I could've sworn I said 'best' 'most important' etc. But never 'only'. And still it is THE BEST as it's been PROVED to work in practice over 90 TIMES. DO you know something that works better?  (again you can do better than this, no?)

I have explained why you can't claim this as the "best" or "most important".  Sorry for thinking you thought it was the only source need.  My first response in this post was the example of the words you use that illustrate your position that it is the only source that is important, despite what you just said about not saying so explicitly, you do say it implicitly.

As for the rest of what you posted above, it's obviously flawed, it's only your perception of what you think I said and believe ... not what I do.

That's your perception of my perception.  When you use words, you need to look at how they convey a meaning, choose them more carefully maybe so that the proper meaning is given.  Where you don't say things like this in relation to the authority of the Bible in our current frame work of understanding the issue: "at least all we need to know".  If you can't see what those 6 words say about the Bible being the "all we need to know", I don't know what to say...

AND ALWAYS WITHOUT DOUBT THE ATTACK OF ALL THINGS 'GOD' WAS FIRST AND FORMOST ON THEIR AGENDA. EXPLAIN TO ME WHY'D THEY BOTHER IF IT'S A FAIRY TALE? OR IF THERE IS NOTHING WE CAN REDEM FOR OURSELVES IN THAT BOOK?. A thorough belief in God has always proved to be a stumbling block for them. And within Muslim countries too. Please don't confuse this with modern church or religion, what are talking here is about true belief in God and His word and nothing else (in the religious spectrum).

Yes it's their agenda.  As stated previously, the indoctrinating power in molding peoples mind to reject and accept only certain things is a very powerful tool.  I don't see why you can't understand this aspect of religion of faith belief in "God".... it doesn't need to be anything more than a fairytale for people to adhere to it and form a strict "this is bad that is evil" conception of things.  It is a tool to control the mind.  Of course there are things we can redeem from the book, I never said there wasn't.  But I would limit myself to the NT, as that is the only decently altruistic part of the book.  As for church, religion, belief in "God", they are forms a dogmatic belief of adherence to a certain set of beliefs that create a given rule set for people to adhere to in common.  A useful tool, you don't need "God " to accept the valid teachings therein.......

Your right, I don't know for you personally, for Latin and Canard I'm fairly certain it is bias. And what facts? For the answer; again go back to the beginning. Your coming into this half way but Latin and others do know what I'm referring to. Again not a false claim, but maybe for you ..but even that I still doubt... you are a dime a dozen you can't explain away my original points yet you still somehow know I'm wrong. If that's not just a bias then it seems your holding out, cause even within this post you've proved very little except that I don't personally know you.

You still assume bias, without understanding how or why we have reached or current understanding.  You are bias yourself:

1 : to give a settled and often prejudiced outlook to

You are prejudging Latin, Canard and myself without knowing our complete position, instead assuming we refuse to use the source you so adamantly revere because we cannot disprove, debunk, or refute it.  I have explained why we do not use it.  I do not see why, for someone who is apparently not biased, you were not able to come to your own understanding as to why we do not use that book as our primary source for "all we need to know" about them.  It is not the source to know "all we need to know".  Keep living in your bubble.

Touchy? Well maybe, but this forum should be about truth, not promoting theories, and especially not theories that, as we are repeatedly reminded, are very huge concepts hard to follow and conceptualize.

Ok, so let's just keep it dumbed down, let's not look at the details, let's not try to get a greater understanding of things.  Let's just use the Bible as the most important and best source to uncover them and their ways.  Good luck on your journey doing that.  Leave us on our own journey.  Can't you understand this?  To each our own... you have your way of explaining the issue to people by using the Bible, we have another way.  But I bet you will continue to ignore this and still harp on about how we need to focus on the Bible ad the most important and best source.

Why? Cause there IS NEVER truth in extreme complication, is it their tool not ours. They notoriously use complexity to hide their blatantly evil practices from us.

Attempting to associate our desire to uncover more detail in this matter with their practices of complication matters is egregious.  There is one level you can go on, that is, they are bad... we know they are bad... this is why.  That is one level.  We are going to other levels to uncover more.  If you think we are falling into their trap, their tool, then point taken.  Please do not reiterate it.  The issue is complex on other levels.  You don't like intricacies, the details, well good for you.  I have stated this several times over and over, let us go about it our own way.  Stop trying to impose you perceived better understanding or better source of information (Bible) on us.  No one is forcing you to listen to a show you do not agree with.

From their banking practices to how they explain away why they need a 25 foot concrete wall around their cuntry[SIC]. But it is the truth that they always have to pile these complexities on. It's hidden in this camouflage. Usury is usury, but to them it's 'interest compacted bi-annually and subtracted from your income at a rate of a precontrived inflation to mirror the rising cost of re-creating these moneys to further help in continuing to provide the general public with relief in ways only a government can' .... Or something along those lines ...of course their explanations need lawyers to decipher. The truth is ALWAYS dead simple.

Yes those are simply truths.  We know this stuff.  We want to know more.  You don't.  End of line, move on, go listen to something else you are more interested in.

Why is it you feel what you provided here is important and what I did is not

My shit is clearly not important, my explanations clearly escape your understanding of what I am trying to convey.  Yours is not important because all you keep saying is "you guys ignore the best source, you guys can't debunk it, you guys cant refute it, you guys are bias, you guys don't make valid arguments, you guys deny truth".  That is the general message of your repeated posts about the material.

especially considering yours is easily deconstructed and mine remains solid?

Right... easily deconstructed, which you claim but fail to do... just keep ignoring how you prefer to use the Bible and we don't, so we are doing it wrong, ignore the reasons for not using the Bible as the main, best, most important source... keep deluding yourself.  Your posts are not "solid" as you claim, more indications that you are in denial and actually go into the territory you claim Latin is, that is of being "a little conceited".  You ignore all of the valid points I made, and state my points are easily deconstructed while you fail to amply do so and assert yours as "solid"... wow...

Or that I might not understand it?

OMG!  Obviously you are not understanding it.  I have to keep repeating the points over and over!  I explain quite thoroughly in this post how your position on the Bible as the best most important source on them is erroneous to use on non-believers, maybe now you will understand it?  Don't use apologetics that all we need is to indoctrinate people into accepting the beliefs of the Bible once more, making mind slaves out of them is not the ethical solution.

My points remain the same and unchallenged, I do no need to do interviews or make radio shows to prove them either.

Of course they are unchallenged for you, you refuse to either read, understand or acknowledge the points made, so of course they remain unchallenged in your denial mindset.

Though I like Latin's abilities, I do not like him working on theories that I can easily dismiss as flawed, if I'm proven wrong then fine I'll concede it but so far that has not happened.

I hope now u can acknowledge the many points I have raised to refute why we don't use the Bible.  "easily dismiss as flawed"... no that isn't conceited is it... you are so grand that you easily - in your supreme understanding of the issue of the Bible being the best and most important "all we need to know" source of info on them - dismiss anything we say to refute your claims as being an absolute flaw.  Good job

Speak the truth and I have no problem, that's what we're all 'in together' on. ... right?.. ..getting to the truth? So deconstruct my original points or dispute Latin as his points are now flawed if mine stand - do one or the other.

Isn't that what I have been doing?  Showing you how your assertions are not correct?  Keep asserting your points as correct and Latin's as flawed by not acknowledging the validity of my explanations on the Bible and anything else I have illustrated.  It feels good to live in your world of denial right?  You are right, we are wrong, simply by asserting it to be so, despite any and all explanations to the contrary, since those explanations are "easily deconstructed" according your denial to understand them.

The point –yet again – was brought up by Latin and again I'm helping this movement by encouraging those to look there (and not only there) for the best source of understanding their character. I am starting to think you really don't get it.

I said in my previous post, and further elaborated in this one, how I do get the validity of the description of the "Jews" in the Bible. You are the one who doesn't get why we don't use that as the best and most important "all we need to know" source on them.  Please grasp this concept as I have illustrated in these posts.

Cause I challenge Latin that means I'm not respecting him?

What I said was "start respecting other people's choice of material they want to discuss and listen to".  Why did I say that?  ->  

"Understanding our enemy in their nature is what we need to focus on, not the intricacies of their internal structure."
"Who gives a f@ck?"
"Why spend the time to figure out how they structured it?"
"Every Talmudic Jew is your enemy, period. What else do you need to know?"
"This is the 'elephant in the room' that Mutha was referring to. It's right in front of you guys, but it seems your media driven preconceptions of God is the hardest thing for you to drop."
"Or , figure out their inner structure, the historical way these structures always come into being etc. Then what? ... Oh yeah, back to praying!"

Given the above, you don't care about our desire to go about uncovering more information.  You don't see the intricacies as important.  You don't give a fuck about these intricacies.  You don't think their is merit in spending time on how it is structured.  You don't think we need to know anything else other than "Every Talmudic Jew is your enemy".  You think we are biased by media preconceptions.  You reduce the argument to an oversimplified portrayal of after looking at the structure and history we are going to go pray... wtf...

If you cannot see how that is not respecting our desire to do things differently than you, step outside of your ego and look at it again.

I haven't resorted to name calling, I may be crude in my point making, but again feelings be damned ..this is the pursuit of truth and it goes wherever it leads guided ONLY by that which can be proved to be true, and by working theories which cannot be disproven.

How about you actually DO THAT, rather than claiming you do that.  For example, stop pushing the assertion that "God" exists (can't be proven), that the Bible was written by this "God" (can't be proven), that humans then were incapable of the insight therein (can't be proven), that they had no understanding of how to create predictions that future people would believe.  You are being extremely hypocritical.  Philosophy, thinking about the environment, is how theological concepts were created!

Perhaps you are right on this point, the bible won't cut it, because to most the perception of message it contains came from the media and the prevailing corrupted church. But if we in this movement used the book (and no church) to illustrate what their up to , and why as well -and even what's to come ...well then yeah the bible would cut it.

The only way for the Bible to cut it is for people to suspend their desire to prove things based on evidence.  The only way the Bible would be accepted in it's whole is by indoctrination in accepting the information therein on blind faith.  That is the only way.  As soon as you allow rationality, logic, reasoning, and a free mind to critically examine the claims made, it is not going to cut it.

However unfortunately its image has long since been smeared for most (and I still suspect you to be one of the 'most' as well) , first you have to get threw that, that takes much effort , to which I can contest, but once done the book reads way differently, like I said; try it out now, now after you are awake.

What it takes is suspension of certain critical faculties, this is where effort comes in.  The effort to suspend certain aspects of thinking by replacing them with faith and belief.  It's that simple.  But of course, this is one of my explanations that you "can easily dismiss as flawed" and "easily deconstructed", right?  Since your beliefs in a faith are just so damn "solid"?  Wow....

I admit here at this forum , apart from Mutha and a few others I am alone on this, but this is not the case in the movement of which we are a part of. This is why I do critique Latin, as he seems to want to steer away from that and offer new explanations to an ancient and already explained phenomenon. Do you understand that?

Like I said before, and this is getting tiresome, the literary tools used in the Bible can be explained without resorting to blind acceptance of the accounts therein.  The information is out there, you just haven't looked into it enough.  And I am not here to prevent you from believing in it.  Just stop trying to tell us how right you are in that these "truths" you believe in are provable, when they are not!  Critique as you want, just respect our desire to go about uncovering additional info that you don't give a fuck about, don't care about.  You don't see me going to khanverse's forum to tell them how their beliefs are incorrect.  Pick your battles more accurately, since you claim to adhere to the concept we are all in this together, keep your beliefs to yourself, I don't want to here it, this forum is not the place for such beliefs.

"ancient and already explained phenomenon. Do you understand that?"  LOL.  Yeah they are explained when you suspend your critical thinking and accept the fable spun for you.  I do understand that!

How did they get us to turn our backs on such traditions, morals and common decency? First and foremost by removing the Christian identify, trivializing it and segregating it

Yup, all true, as I have stated above, and I give my reasons why this is true.  Reasons you do not like, accept, or possibly understand.  But they are no less valid, or "solid".

This would indicate; no they are not always the 'ruling class' (never my term to begin with but fine) , but they always try to be and occasionally succeed for a limited time. However, again, this time it's for the grand prize... the whole planet... they've never quite made it to this level before, this is new.

Congratulations!  You concede that they are not the ruling class, that you made that error in your previous post.  Now you just have some more conceding to acknowledge the importance in going into history to determine the details of how things happened.  To make a strong case, you need details, despite your desire to keep it simple, simplicity won't cut it for many people.  Trying all of history together IS important.

It all ties together, but it is YOU who needs to come to realize that.

Have have I not realized it?  You make another assumption.  I do see the historical aspect, and that is the importance in Off Tangent.  You don't see this, or you see the shows in a different light, ok, fine, criticize it on your own perceptions.  Just understand your perception might not be the correct one, and that we do have a purpose in dealing with the underlying "intricacies".  If you still don't care about them, for "Gods" sake, stop listening to the show!

And on that note, I will not respond to you again.  These diatribe takes way too long to compose and is clearly not worth it.

Peace.

[GordZilla]

What you missed is the part when I explained how history repeats?


How would you begin to study that pattern? What would be the method?.

Hi Latin,

First thanks for weighing in.

How would I study the pattern? Not sure I'd spend the time doing that at all. Only know that the spread of Christianity (even Islam for that matter) is by far the best, and proven, method for outing these bastards. The pattern has already been explained by me, albeit briefly and simply, it is none-the-less been 'studied'.


Has it ever occurred to you that these are opposing power groups? Moreover, It seems that your ethno-centric view does not address various positions that reject imperialism and religious conquest. I am ameri-indian- Christianity is not our not natural religion. I only mention this because you seem to be OK WITH SERFDOM AS LONG AS THE RULERS ARE CHRISTIAN! It is precisouly these conditions that create disaffection among the subject classes leading to revolution where Jews have take the reigns and lead us all down the primrose path.

Yes it has, Talmudic Jews vrs the rest of us. And again the "various positions that reject imperialism and religious conquest" have most often been Christianity, even in the face of Roman Catholics and other 'religions'.  And again you're 'ameri-indian' ?? Perhaps you believe yourself to be but your are not in the eyes of your fellow countrymen. Lets look back for a sec; your parents could get up and leave when communism reared its ugly head on 'your people'. You have access to a government document with a seal on it, which you contend will get killed if they were to discover it in your possession. You speak fluent English and are a college grad. You have a computer, an internet connection and time to spend on the internet. All while living in the 2nd poorest country in the western hemisphere, do you really think 'your people' feel this same connection to you? Besides I did mention other religions as well later down in my reply, but regardless, it's Christianity that they fear most (a point you still cannot deny) as it's the one religion that exposes them more aptly than any other on the face of the earth, but almost all of them at least teach of goodness, fair-play and the injustice of murder, usury etc. So in that case almost all religions could accomplish the same as Christianity has in the past, but none will be nearly as effective.

Pattern;

Good Christians live peacefully as serfs of their respective states, yes the ruling class is not (at this point) a completely innocent and benevolent one – they will invoke taxes, maybe start unjust persecutions etc., however for the most part there is peace on the land.

In your own words.
Talmudic Jews slowly integrate themselves into the landscape, as always 'secretively' at first until their teeth are set into the skin of the current ruling class. Until the current ruling class, monarchy what have you, becomes indebted to them –threw whatever underhanded means; blackmail, usury etc.

Yes then usually they get the masses to attack their masters only to replace them with Jewish masters. In short the masses always have to have some sor of masses. Why do you think that is?

First I'm not clear by what you mean, but if you're suggesting that there has always been ruling classes, than yes I concur, there has always been serfdom too. The masses usually do not revolt until such levels of tyranny and injustice provoke them too. This high level is almost entirely and singlehandedly brought to them by Talmudic Jews, and throughout history. I never said it was a perfect tool for beating them, just the best known to date. And again PROVEN effective. After all, apart from a couple of Muslim countries, who else has ever been able to out them from their native regions?

The current ruling class than increases their tyranny on its peoples to help collect wealth to repay their newly occurred debt. Often this causes distaste even within the publically perceived ruling class themselves (often 'good' kings wanted to remain that way, but their hand got forced).

I think it is a whole lot more complicated then that. I have not been able to do as much research needed to make a show on this topic.

 I'm sure you would think that, but that does little to take away from the point. This is how it has historically happened, Germany has some of the best examples of this in its history... but of course they are not alone.

The ignorant, but God's law obeying, serfs start to feel the pressure of higher and unjust taxation. 'Ignorant' maybe in banking practices, but not ignorant in just and unjust actions (thanks to their faith), the serfs become slowly more and more discontented.
Cant this this better explained by social engineering techniques. Unfortunately it involves science. It certian seems like the current ruling class has turn to this model in addition to their Talmudic ways. Why do you think that Jews have turned to science to help implement their evil plan. (Please say evil- in DR. Evil voice)

You would have to explain it another way, I do not need to.  The Talmudic Jew of course has used science. What point you trying to make there, they used art, media science the re-writing of history ...anything they can. But their target always remains the same ..and that's the point. Better explained with "by social engineering techniques" ??  If by 'better explained' you mean by having the audience understand it, than no – obviously not. However that is your style, to over complicate the simple ... so feel free.

They unite under the banner of their faith and rebel, or put pressure on their ruling class, or riot outright –until legislation and/or physical action removes the parasite from their lands.

Securing the help of the superstitious masses is the most effective way of forcing change.

Yup and change is exactly what we need now, no? Thanks for making my point.  And again science itself is superstition.  A point you often forget. The only reason is not openly considered as such is from its mass acceptance, but this same 'mass acceptance' at one point believed,  just as surely as you believe in your dogma now, that the earth is flat. At least religion's message stays the same, you'd rather believe and put your faith in something forever changing and never concrete, your choice I guess.

Then back to sleep they go, peacefully once again ... until the Talmudic Jew returns. Then the cycle repeats.

The world can be seen as a bushel of fruit, ripe and clean. The Talmudic Jew can be seen as the parasite who slowly rots this fruit from within. In the past we could throw out the pieces of fruit that were fully infected with the parasite and still spare the remainder. This time around the whole bushel is infected, and the fruits defenses, it's skin, has been weekend sufficiently enough that the spread of their disease is done almost effortlessly - it's done for them. This time around we can't just separate the spoiled fruit from the rest, this time around it is the whole bushel that must be tossed and we must restart completely with a new seed. A seed still crafted from the old plant, but untouched (for now) by the parasite.
Wordy and really does nothing to further our understanding.

Wordy? This from Latin?  And 'it does nothing to further' your understanding but it is not lost on everyone, rest assured. Analogy is the best way to explain concepts to people, it is the easiest way to be understood, this is why I chose that format. You choose to use a more complicated approach, all the while trying to justify this complication in some fallacy that these concepts are too huge for mere mortals to grasp. As if it's the only way to explain it, well its not. There are people way further along in their personal advancement in their understanding of these concepts, even though many of them could not readily articulate them as learnedly as you do. This is no way makes their points less valid. Complication is never needed, from brain surgery to hop scotch anything can be taught to virtually anyone, only some may take longer than others.  (I say 'virtually' , as the mentally handicapped cannot be included in this statement, but the slow can .... it'll just take you longer to reach them)

Our best hope is to keep those new 'seeds for the future' knowledgeable about the past, to have them ready to recognize the parasite when it re-emerges (as it always does).

To them this is the part they have yet to destroy, this very seed of knowledge of who they really are. This is the part they fear the most, that one of those seeds might get by their radar and re-ignite the spark of knowledge that will eventually and yet again lead to the discovering of their parasitical ways.

And who or what do they see as this seed? As this big threat to exposing them once again?

Science? No.
Philosophy (even radical philosophy)? No.
Arts? No.

I guess what you are saying is that only religion can really explain what is going on? How does the religious tradition explain the scientific implementation of tyranny?

Nope, I said it's the best way. What I was saying above is; what do they see as their biggest threat.  And religion doesn't have to explain the 'scientific implementation of tyranny' first off cause it needs only  to expose it to it's faithful. And Secondly why would you feel, at all, that there would be a need to scientifically explain tyranny? How useless is that?
Except to make oneself sound knowledgeable it is a completely useless study. All you need to know about tyranny is how to recognize and fight it. Again exploring it's inner structure is a useless endeavour except for the academic principles it might contain. For our purposes though? There is no use to know 'who takes crap from whom then shits on who's head?' WHO CARES!  Tyranny is tyranny and enough is enough, this is all we need to know on that front.

You can talk to your blue in the face about intergovernmental or ruling class philosophy or structure and they would care not. You, to them, do not carry the seed to their demise. Nope, the answer is simple (and proven) yet again.

Christian ideology! you bet'cha!
Prove it!

.These were just a few questions that I have.

Cheers
Latin

Just how many times will suffice?
I mean seriously, history has proven it. The only reason you ask for proof, it seems, is you're either not reading what I'm writing here, or you're simply not understanding it. I have left points further back that you can't dispute as well, yet you try to deconstruct this post in some vain attempt to remove credibility from my words. You cannot. Not with earlier points still standing, and not with many points still standing here within this current post.
Science is not the end-all of reasoning, science is in fact more flawed than the belief in God's word. His words pan out, time and time again, His predictions steadfastly hold true. His laws are what form the backbone of our best laws and governments. His taught morals, if practiced, make for better humans. etc.  Science? Wait till next week, it'll all be different. Science is nothing more than man's failing attempts at describing, naming, measuring and categorizing all that He created. If fact science itself can be used to prove creation, however you won't look into that either.

-Gord

p.s. ;  again,  don't confuse 'God's word' with religion, if you try to retort that old line of 'look at all the evils 'religion' has done in the name of God', I will not need to address it. As again it will be your misconception of what I wrote and what you perceived to have read. I know religion has done terrible things in the name of God. These things were never done by the righteous, they are always carried out by the wicked under the banner of God, to try to gain acceptance for their transgressions, from the common folk. And as always they are found out and removed by the truly righteous. The people who do not put their stock in the church, but rather only in God's word.







P.S.S ; aZiXx Please read what I've said not what you thought I might have meant. I'm growing tired of you. You have nothing but a load voice. WHEN DID I SAY THE BIBLE IS ALL WE NEED? Hell I pointed out twice now that I never did say that, nor that is the 'only' thing we need. As for the rest of your post.... again, whatever!, believe what you want. I'm just a little beyond you my friend; you are back tracking vainly rather than honestly looking into what I have written. Are you afraid of something you may find?

"because it's all repetition about how your wonderful book is the only thing that is needed to understand them"

– See what I mean?  You only comment on what you perceive I have wrote, not what I actually have.

"No way it was written by human hands? LMAO. You're a riot of assumptions raging towards the finish line of "God" exists because he wrote it.

Humans wrote it."

There's another funny one, in fact your post if full of funny examples like this. The original  point I made with Latin, after his blanket statement, was that there is now way from at least 1000 years ago (at least, as I believe it to be more), With predictions and descriptions of Khazars , a people not even founded by the time of it's original writing.  Predictions that have born out. Talmudic Jewish insight (and yes covering even the ancient civilizations you mentioned) that are at  least 1500 years before Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice and still put it to shame. etc, please revisit my first post, Those are some of the points I was referring to and are still uncontested. And I'm here defending this perspective, not cause I want to win your hearts and minds, but rather because you guys are completely dismissing it without any factual backing for doing so. Like you saying the term Jew came from Judea ...oh that put a nail in my argument. How blind are you? I'm here posting in defence of what you guys readily term as laughable, even though as far as addressing my points you are silent. But hell, for addressing your interpreted perception of my points, your cup run us over. Not to mention, if it's fantasy, how do you explain that Jesus and all things about Him are first and foremost on the Talmudic Jews hit list?  They know it's not fantasy, they know it's our best defence that is plain to see – but apparently not by all.
Man you're blind.

[greyknight7]

PROTOCOL No. 14
    1. When we come into our kingdom it will be undesirable for us that there should exist any other religion than ours of the One God with whom our destiny is bound up by our position as the Chosen People and through whom our same destiny is united with the destinies of the world. We must therefore sweep away all other forms of belief. If this gives birth to the atheists whom we see to-day, it will not, being only a transitional stage, interfere with our views, but will serve as a warning for those generations which will hearken to our preaching of the religion of Moses, that, by its stable and thoroughly elaborated system has brought all the peoples of the world into subjection to us. Therein we shall emphasize its mystical right, on which, as we shall say, all its educative power is based .... Then at every possible opportunity we shall publish articles in which we shall make comparisons between our beneficent rule and those of past ages. The blessing of tranquility, though it be a tranquility forcibly brought about by centuries of agitation, will throw into higher relief the benefits to which we shall point. The errors of the GOYIM governments will be depicted by us in the most vivid hues. We shall implant such an abhorrence of them that the peoples will prefer tranquility in a state of serfdom to those rights of vaunted freedom which have tortured humanity and exhausted the very sources of human existence, sources which have been exploited by a mob of rascally adventurers who know not what they do .... USELESS CHANGES OF FORMS OF GOVERNMENT TO WHICH WE INSTIGATED THE "GOYIM" WHEN WE WERE UNDERMINING THEIR STATE STRUCTURES, WILL HAVE SO WEARIED THE PEOPLES BY THAT TIME THAT THEY WILL PREFER TO SUFFER ANYTHING UNDER US RATHER THAN RUN THE RISK OF ENDURING AGAIN ALL THE AGITATIONS AND MISERIES THEY HAVE GONE THROUGH.

WE SHALL FORBID CHRIST

    2. At the same time we shall not omit to emphasize the historical mistakes of the GOY governments which have tormented humanity for so many centuries by their lack of understanding of everything that constitutes the true good of humanity in their chase after fantastic schemes of social blessings, and have never noticed that these schemes kept on producing a worse and never a better state of the universal relations which are the basis of human life ....

    3. The whole force of our principles and methods will lie in the fact that we shall present them and expound them as a splendid contrast to the dead and decomposed old order of things in social life.

    4. Our philosophers will discuss all the shortcomings of the various beliefs of the "GOYIM," BUT NO ONE WILL EVER BRING UNDER DISCUSSION OUR FAITH FROM ITS TRUE POINT OF VIEW SINCE THIS WILL BE FULLY LEARNED BY NONE SAVE OURS WHO WILL NEVER DARE TO BETRAY ITS SECRETS.

    5. IN COUNTRIES KNOWN AS PROGRESSIVE AND ENLIGHTENED WE HAVE CREATED A SENSELESS, FILTHY, ABOMINABLE LITERATURE. For some time after our entrance to power we shall continue to encourage its existence in order to provide a telling relief by contrast to the speeches, party program, which will be distributed from exalted quarters of ours .... Our wise men, trained to become leaders of the GOYIM, will compose speeches, projects, memoirs, articles, which will be used by us to influence the minds of the GOYIM, directing them towards such understanding and forms of knowledge as have been determined by us.

I see a show that is literally off tangent.  

A talk show host bashing people of Christan faith, on a forum that forbids religious discussion, surrounded by a group of fan boys.

I see one person here holding a discussion with...how many?  Three? All of whom by spite or ignorance completely and utterly miss the point.

Truth is your all still very much effected by double think.  You all act with that canned hatred for a book, influenced by Hollywood.  Ingrained in you is that Jewish producer of family ties telling you "Christ=oppression, non-belief structures=freedom".  :roll:

 Your all still under the sheets, and until you get your heads out of your asses a realize that the very point of you being atheist is in their works, well you ant getting to the bottom of anything.  Godzilla's points are valid, and the funny thing is even an atheist can see it.  I guess just not the atheists that are always going off tangent.

I don't care what you believe in/don't believe in.  You just got to realize where you are and how you got there.

P.S. don't consider myself a Christan, just awake.

[LatinAmericanview]

"A talk show host bashing people of Christan faith, on a forum that forbids religious discussion, surrounded by a group of fan boys."


This just not true. Here you are debating religon. I have merely suggested that some of us want to use a different paradigm. Gordzilla insists that we not forget the lessons of th bible.  We have bent over backwards to answer his questions. Please feel free to check over the threads.  Lastly if the Jews want to Forbid Christ then Christianity MUST BE TRUE.  Thank you for opening my eyes.

[Canard]

How many troll accounts is Gordzilla going to make?

[GordZilla]

How many troll accounts is Gordzilla going to make?

You can't be serious?  When you have Texe Marrs the other night on DBS talking some of the same stuff as we are here and you'd think I'm the only one who might share these opinions? The reality is, within this movement, our numbers are growing. Why? Because unless you're completely blind and bias, you have to, at some point, come to the conclusion that this whole thing has more ties to God and the devil than anything else, despite your best efforts this remains the truth. Whether or not He is real, well that's another question, but within 'the conspiracy' His name, and His counterpart's, will come up often. Get used to it.

-Gord

P.S. "if the Jews want to Forbid Christ then Christianity MUST BE TRUE"  - Well yeah, it definitely should at least get you thinking about it. But alas it's an avenue you fear to tread. To bad, this  'truth' movement is afraid to explore truth.

[Canard]

How many troll accounts is Gordzilla going to make?

You can't be serious?  When you have Texe Marrs the other night on DBS talking some of the same stuff as we are here and you'd think I'm the only one who might share these opinions? The reality is, within this movement, our numbers are growing. Why? Because unless you're completely blind and bias, you have to, at some point, come to the conclusion that this whole thing has more ties to God and the devil than anything else, despite your best efforts this remains the truth.

Its like competing stories to me.  I don't really respect your position for multiple reasons, you've constantly gotten irrational in your posts. As many of your ilk, you've done the usual catholic bashing dance, I mean they worship the same story you do, just a variation, and you complain about church goers, you just read the book as you've said.  If those guys piss you off, what's an atheist who demands strict rationalism such as myself got to hope for?  Those strict bible readers who use the bible as a life manual for all things commonly fit a mold, I've given you every chance, but it's not going to work out.  I really hoped we could find a common ground, but you had to make effort too, and you didn't.  Strict rationalists such as myself versus strict ir-rationalists is a losing battle and speaking to you is to devolve my own thinking and discourse.  You demand upon unprovable 'truths', that's what faith is.  Your book, demands upon itself. Self reference = nothing.  That is the problem.  You are weak and need the blanket of faith, to get out of bed everyday.  I know we are born, we are animals who talk, and then the bugs eat us.  USE THIS TIME WISELY, ITS ALL YOU GET.  The factual evidence shows as such, your 'belief system' requires suspension of disbelief; much like The Dark Knight film. Does jesus set forth a great example? yes.  I'll leave it at that.  I know I can work with those who are religious, but a common ground of mutual respect must be reached.  We have bent over backwards to accommodate you for months, frankly you're annoying.

Whether or not He is real, well that's another question, but within 'the conspiracy' His name, and His counterpart's, will come up often. Get used to it.

That kind of reminds me of the slogan; 'we're here, we're queer get used to it'.
We know the jesus versus the talmudists is a theme, its part of history as these stories have both been. Duh, much? It's like the flip side of a coin.  It means nothing as far as proving the intangible, man invented deity is up there loving us all. What about Thor?  Where did Zeus go?  Is Loki real too?  Truly Apollo must exist, right?  How is jesus more valid then Ganesha? Id like to ask you;  How do you reconcile these hundreds of other man made god's?  Why are they false?  What did a carpenter from Bethlehem do to demand your devotion above Ahura Mazda?  What about the 20 or so similiar stories preceeding jesus, nimrod, horace etc....(covered in Zeitgeist and other films aswell)  How is it anything more then a refining of the same story?
Random question, did Noah really gather 2 of everything and put them on a boat?  :geek:

P.S. "if the Jews want to Forbid Christ then Christianity MUST BE TRUE"  - Well yeah, it definitely should at least get you thinking about it.

Should doesn't factor into it.  Something either Is or is not.  Jews also insist upon education, should I therefore stop reading to defy them?  :lol:

But alas it's an avenue you fear to tread.

:twisted:
Hey you know who's scared? You, you're so special you don't want to die  :cry: and need to exist beyond this mortal life, so you are so irrational your brain demands upon this story, which in turns DEMANDS UPON ITSELF.  We all are going to the same place when we die.  I've got an axiom for you; Truth Hurts.

To bad, this  'truth' movement is afraid to explore truth.

:| I love your referring to a fable as truth.  What have you to say about the truth of the big bad wolf? Too bad all your posts are identical. Ill feed you no longer.

[GordZilla]

Canard,

 Once again your brilliance astonishes me, you should stick to you cheerleading role ...your much better at that.

Ok one last time;
My original post to Latin gave a RATIONAL[/u] argument that no one here has still been able to address (other than to say 'your wrong, and we just know it' and 'which bible?' – what a bunch of crap)
Also I provided a link which is chalked full of scientific proof of Creation, which again you cannot not touch.

And you've 'fed' me nothing but bull shit since.

Address it, as that's the scientific way, if you cannot discount my original points then you have a problem...your solution so far? Ignore it.  
 
Wait to be 'rational' Canard!

And bare in mind, the original post was posted there in the face of insult from your favorite guy, it was NOT unprovoked.

-Gord

[Canard]

When are you going to apologize for bringing up religion on a non religious forum?  I know you love that we indulge your little fantasies.  I wont bother to address the specifics of your post, all one needs to do is read my post just above.  I believe both Az and Latin have addressed your 'points' and 'sources', several times.  So Noah really gathered up 900 thousand different types of insects?  Two of each? Brilliant.

[GordZilla]

When are you going to apologize for bringing up religion on a non religious forum?  I know you love that we indulge your little fantasies.  I wont bother to address the specifics of your post, all one needs to do is read my post just above.  I believe both Az and Latin have addressed your 'points' and 'sources', several times.  So Noah really gathered up 900 thousand different types of insects?  Two of each? Brilliant.

Ah , no they haven't it's not even in this thread. And Latin brought it up, I commented on it with the tag line that I knew it was a non-religious forum but the point was raised, for which it was noted by one of the admins....seemed to be no problem, then. Go back and read it for yourself.

And one more time for the reading impared, NO THEY HAVEN'T !!

Isreal, where'd the name even come from? (and that wasn't even one of the first points, just yet another you can't answer, I could go on and on....really quite easy. And I also stated to Latin that I would comment no more unless provoked, which YOU did by suggesting I'm creating multiple accounts...you should plainly see by now I have no problem working alone, I know these original points are untouchable, they been attempted by greater men than us for over a thousand years, you think Latin is his mere, what 30 years?, is going to come up with a theory to explain away what they couldn't??)

If you say nothing to provoke me, or slander (in a general fashion) against people who 'believe' than I will not post a retort. I thought the first time Latin and I had a go that we might have reached that understanding, but, what 2 audios later?, he did it again. Call'm churchies, Catholics, Pope pushers, Haggee's boys and girls and I'll have no problem, blanket statements that include people like me? Well then I may have an issue.
I  had said to him how his statement is irrational and unless he (or anybody) could rebut the following points I made then it would remain an inaccurate point. It has since remained as such -inaccurate.
Tell you what, to drop this issue and carry on I will offer you a bone of peace in the form of a video that you and your fellow compadres may enjoy, a couple vids actually, just to lighten the mood;

[youtube:1ial0og2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qapa7Xv4H-M[/youtube]1ial0og2]


[youtube:1ial0og2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zV5UTHRx0a4[/youtube]1ial0og2]

p.s. 'insects' are explained too, you really have to look closer, but you haven't looked at all. Check the link I left back there, you could spend a month or more just going thru what that one 'little' site has to offer on the topic, and much of it is from a scientific stand point. That page is not alone in its views, Soon, my friend, evolution shall be as much as a fable as you see God to be, then what?

No they evolved from stardust, brillant!  :lol:

[Anonymous]

boys boys boys
divide and conquer
everyones journey is different, personalized and unique.

i personally don't believe in evolution, from the fact the Jackals invented and merge it into communism. intelligent design seems more plausible than creationism.

i am interested in the bible because the Masons use it, but not in the way Christians use it.

I would say that personal attacks should stop and respect for others regardless of their beliefs should be observed.

i find it interesting that the term theory means belief in the dictionary and also that christianity is built on faith and belief.

belief does not make something true, but I would hate to think of life without believing in something.

peace.

[Anonymous]

I actually just wanted to drop some thoughts about the show. I think that Latin is exploring the how history repeats and this reminds me of animal farm and the 7 commandments and how the middle [pigs] became corrupt as time went on. Fortunately we have more info then orwell in that we know the pigs were corrupt to begin with.

1. Whatever goes on two legs is an enemy.

2. Whatever goes on four legs, or has wings, is a friend.

3. No animal shall wear clothes.

4. No animal shall sleep in a bed.

5. No animal shall drink alcohol.

6. No animal shall kill any other animal.

7. All animals are equal.

http://www.123helpme.com/view.asp?id=15455

Lastly I would have to say that understanding the structure and previous structures of control must be learned for rebuilding. lest we leave that task to some nice jewish lawyers that have our best interest in mind. If we are going to tear the system down we better be well educated in order to prevent tyrany's ugly head surfacing again. for this reason alone i don't mind listening to Latin's show

I would also say that the epic battle of the formation of the constitution should be studied. It was only because of the anti-federalist that human rights were included.

Q. "When did you realize that you were God?"
A. "While praying. I realized I was talking to myself." --The 14th Earl of Gurney (Peter O'Toole), who has the delusion that he is Jesus Christ in The Ruling Class

[youtube:1p8mmy6r]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJllCaANHs4[/youtube]1p8mmy6r]

[LatinAmericanview]

Gorzilla is BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!  He has made it a point to muddy the waters and not discuss any of the topics I bring up.  This show does not make any religious claims and if I did it was in passing and not central to my argument. Look at the topics covered section of my post!


However look at gordzilla's posting history-   The man is stalking me.  Here is my evidence

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[LatinAmericanview]

Savage please Check your mail!

I am currently working on a show linking Plato,Bacon,T.H. Huxley,Aldus Huxely, Darwin, and Orwell together.  Animal Farm was written as a fairy tale for th masses. 1984 was written for the Administrative class.

[GordZilla]

Gorzilla is BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!  He has made it a point to muddy the waters and not discuss any of the topics I bring up.  This show does not make any religious claims and if I did it was in passing and not central to my argument. Look at the topics covered section of my post!


However look at gordzilla's posting history-   The man is stalking me.  Here is my evidence

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What you didn't say "those that believe in God are idiots" ? You didn't say that or similar ??  ...I suggest you look back, and there are many posts as we have been batting back and forth, I respond,  you respond etc (and Canard of course too) and as for bullshit? you still haven't addressed my original point. .... so the bullshit is in your court. However as I said before; I'm willing to drop it too, if unprovoked I will, Canard brought me back into it this time....

Say what you want Latin, but follow the history first before you assume I'm 'stalking' you, I only rebutted your original (and second ) smear against all those that are religious. Now it may have been 'in passing' for you, but for some it was insulting. The rest of the posting history was drawn out in debate from the original post. I have bullshitted not.

-Gord