Charles Giuliani Hosts Debate YouTube/ADL Alleged Hasbara Troll August 21 2012

[LordLindsey]

Below is the comment that I left after seeing how people are getting suckered by this Troll playing the "good cop" and the level of disgust at this spin-session simply can not be put into words, so I will let you listeners be the judge of what you hear.

Charles dealt with this issue/interview with kid-gloves, and I am absolutely DISGUSTED how this Troll was able to go from one issue to another to another without saying ANYTHING of substance, and then saying basically that it doesn't matter what is said because he will not change "his mind."  He said this toward the end of the show, and after hearing that I blew-a-gasket and absolutely had to tell Charles and his audience what I ABSOLUTELY believe is happening with this "Jan."

Lindsey

http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2012/08/tru ... ni_21.html

"You people may be getting fooled by this Hasbara Troll, but I will not accept his sweet-words with poisonous intent. If you can not see that his intention is to play the "good cop" role and make it seem like he actually is "open" to learning the truths as they are, then you people who are falling for this are just throwing-out all that you have learned about the tricks and the traps of these "people" that we have seen played upon the human-race over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

Fuck that.

I stand ABSOLUTELY by what I believe is happening with this "Jan" and if you can not see it, it is because you are just being snookered by his approach. Regardless of the approach, know that this Hasbarat has an agenda, and it is obviously working.

DESPICABLE.

Lindsey"

[Rockclimber]

Lindsey, your point was well taken. I think most people with a brain know that this guy is a hasbara troll. Charles imo shouldn't entertain this piece of shit ever again because this troll will NEVER change his pov. He's a jew and a jew first despite his attempts to act like he isn't one. But go easy on Charles, you  were very insulting to him and I thought it was uncalled for. In other words your comment 'shame on you' sounded a bit harsh if not arrogant.

I know damn well that you work hard and you have always impressed me with your work and I highly admire your tenacity and promote you every chance I have including your narration of the POZ. Charles is not perfect and makes mistakes BUT he is one of the best voices we have in this truth movement; very few are as bold as he is. Your comments about him 'beating a dead horse' were also uncalled for. This jew religion is the enemy of mankind and should be exposed for what it is;  a jew religion meant to control the 'goy' and to bring into frution their supremacist jew world order. It's not easy for me to say this because I was once a 'christian'. Charles various show's on biblical contradictions are bullet proof and even talmud Timmy can't defeat what Charles says, this coward won't even debate him! It is of the utmost importance that this book of lies is exposed because it fits with all the other lies and agenda's of the supremacist jews, and so many have been duped by this book.

'

[LordLindsey]

My point was that Charles should have done a "Charles Giuliani" on him and nailed him as he did "Pastor" Eli James, but he ABSOLUTELY did not do that because "Jan" was playing the "good cop" role, and Charles was taken-in by the ploy.  I got angrier and angrier the more that I thought about what had happened to Mark Glenn, Mahmoud el Youseph, and John Friend, and I was NOT going to let this Hasbara troll get-away with his tricks and traps.  I apologized to Charles for going after him for not doing what I, and many others, thought he was going to do, and that is that.

As for him beating-a-dead-horse with this religious stuff, I meant what I said.  I had some very important points to make and issues to discuss about what is happening NOW, TODAY, and I thought that since he did not seem to have a topic, then I could say whatever I wanted, but when he started cutting me off I did get pissed-off because he has devoted COUNTLESS shows to this religion issue, and I honestly-to-God believed that he was discussing it then because he did not have anything else to discuss because a guest had canceled on him and he had to do something with which he was familiar.  I sincerely appreciate all that Charles has done and brought-to-the-table, but when an issue is discussed over and over and over and over and over again, and the same things are being said, then what that tells me is the point is made and proofs are delivered, and it is time to go to something else that is not as heavily discussed.

Anyway, the Hasbarat will be on Charles' show on Tuesday at 8 AM EST, at http://www.oraclebroadcasting.com so all of you can listen and/or call-in with your questions and comments.  I think that Charles knows that he made a mistake letting this guy do what he did, and I am pretty sure that it will be a different show than this one.

Lindsey

NB:  I only call-in to shows when I feel that I have something important to bring to the conversation, so you had better believe that I will be calling-in to the show Tuesday.

[Rockclimber]

Well I hope we see the passionate Charles this time with the hasbara Troll.

I really don't think Charles was filling dead air with this religious show imo, I think he has a real genuine passion and anger to expose the religious aspect of this because he nearly poured his whole life into it. I have heard him say that people are getting sick of him talking about it but that he feels it needs to be discussed.

All my respect Lindsey,

Scott

[LordLindsey]

What Charles needs to do to keep the listeners' attention is to DEBATE the issue regularly with people who are ABLE to debate with him, and not the likes of "Pastor" James who are just a joke.  People do not like to hear constructive-criticism, but in this case it is absolutely imperative that Charles realizes that his listeners are burnt-out from hearing this over and over and over again, and that the only way to get people interested in hearing this issue is when something exciting is added to the mix, and that is having someone debate with him so that Charles can really push the issue hardest.  

There is something that I need to say, too.  Most hosts in the "mainstream" talk-radio world devote most of their show to LISTENER PARTICIPATION, where the caller basically becomes a guest for a little while and different issues are discussed.  This is something that really almost never is seen in the "alternative" media, and is really becoming more of an issue now that the "alternative" media is becoming more pronounced.  Listener participation is VITAL to keep the interest of the audience because hearing a host or hostess go on and on and on for an entire show QUICKLY loses its appeal, and this is simply a fact.  How do you think that the drug-addict was/is able to keep his numbers so high for so many years?  It was because he never really had "guests" but made the callers provide that necessity so that he could contribute his right-wing propaganda.  

It is time for the "alternative" media to get-with-the-program and realize that a host or hostess reading from a newspaper or other online medium and taking almost no calls during a show is simply not going to work; I am not speaking about Charles with this, but the concept is almost the same.  Talk-radio is ALL ABOUT THE DIALOGUE, and it is ALL ABOUT THE CALLER CONTRIBUTING SOMETHING IMPORTANT AND WORTHWHILE TO THE CONVERSATION TO MAKE IT NEW AND EXCITING, and I am not talking about "MY" call-ins as I have said REPEATEDLY else-where; I am talking about ANYONE who can participate with something worthwhile to call-in and make the shows special.

What is most troubling to me is that there is NO host/hostess of whom in this "alternative" media I can think who does an "open-lines Friday," or similar day(s) when it is just a discussion with as many callers as are able to fit into the time-slot, bringing whatever they have to the table, and there is absolutely no excuse for this.  Again, I am NOT talking about "ME" calling-in, as I am talking about the importance of the hosts to realize that audience participation is VITAL to a show's interest and success.

Lindsey

[Rockclimber]

Excellent suggestion. I think I will run 'open lines Friday' by him. Can't hurt to ask.

[LordLindsey]

I just wanted to remind everyone that the big debate will be tomorrow, Tuesday, August 28, 2012, at 08:00 AM EST, between Charles and "Jan."  You can listen live at http://www.oraclebroadcasting.com and please promote the show on other shows so that more people will know about it.

Lindsey

[LordLindsey]

This shows what you kind of dodging takes-place when you TRY to defend the in-defensible.  This comes from http://www.grizzom.blogspot.com.

Lindsey

"44 comments:

Ryan said...

    Ahh at least he said sorry. You Guys are doing a great job by the way. Much love.
    August 21, 2012 3:29 PM
Anonymous said...

    Yeah, that apology was spot on.This ''Jan Mueller'' isn't a German but an Israeli jew imo.You can hear it obviously in his accent and on top of that he's using lawyer tactics, which also says a lot to me.
    Thanks for posting.
    Pas.
    August 21, 2012 4:55 PM
Anonymous said...

    Lindsey had a point, what do you guys think about his comments?
    August 21, 2012 10:38 PM
zapoper said...

    It's a good thing that Lindsey called in to point out the Israeli accent. I was so busy listening to that guy dancing around the subject without really addressing it that I didn't even notice the accent.

    Lindsey may be right about him. He may very well be Hasbara.

    The Giuliani apology just shows that he's a decent guy.
    August 22, 2012 12:12 AM
John Friend said...

    I hope our buddy Jan checks out those books I cited about the Holohoax, and actually does so honestly. He'll be on our side in no time!

    Thanks for posting all the interviews and radio shows, good stuff. I've been meaning to let you know that.
    August 22, 2012 12:55 AM
Anonymous said...

    Lindsey was spot on on the accent!(didn't hear the call when I commented) but he did get a bit over emotional in expressing his views.John Friend's call was brilliant.Calm and composed bringing solid info.When ''Jan" asked for scientific proof I directly thought of the Fred Leuchter Report.
    Pas.
    August 22, 2012 2:24 PM
Jan Mueller said...

    Hey, this is Jan.
    First, thank you for listening and calling.
    I could not understand the accusation against me for being a "Hasbara troll" or something like that - I think that I was pretty sincere about my background and my affiliation. I am the son of a Jewish, Israeli father and a German mother. I spent a few years in Israel when both of my parents worked there and attended a Hebrew school. I then moved with my mother to Germany where I live since. I do not posses an Israeli Citizenship (however I am entitled to it if I want to), and I am not Jewish according to the Jewish law (since my mother is not Jewish, but it doesn't mean anything to me since I'm secular).
    If anyone had or has any question about my background I would have and am able to answer, but the attack against me was quite ridiculous. I am attached to Israel, I would definitely consider myself a Zionist (someone who supports the national rights of the Jewish people for sovereignty in their homeland), and I would probably agree with a lot of things claimed by official Israeli Hasbara. Not only that I didn't conceal all that on air - that was the reason why I was invited to speak on the show!

    Lindsey, thank you for the sources you suggested. The books on the holocaust "hoax" are not available in Germany and I have no way to obtain them (unless I order from Amazon UK but then it's quite expensive..).
    Pas - I read a bit about the Leuchter Report, and from what I understand it was scientifically flawed. If I may, a scientific study/proof is not a work that is conducted by a scientist, but a work that adheres to acceptable scientific empirical rules and methods of research. So far, there has been a lot of scientific work on the Jewish holocaust (and other tragedies during WW2), but none of them concluded that the Holocaust is a "hoax".
    It is also important to mention about the holocaust, that it is the name we give today to all the negative events, rules, practices and persecutions against the Jewish people by Nazi Germany and allies during WW2. It is not a single event or a single law, it's a period in Jewish history. I write this since in case one testimony or one event is controversial and there's a debate about, that doesn't mean that the holocaust is a "hoax" or that there was no persecution against European Jews by the Nazis.
    August 23, 2012 12:01 PM
John Friend said...

    Hey Jan, my instinct tells me you are an honest guy, I don't think you are a hasbara troll or anything like that. Of course people are going to say that, but don't let it bother you. People on the internet make all sorts of accusations, most of them without any merit. Don't sweat it man, it comes with the territory.

    Linsdey was the caller after me, I was the one who suggested those books about the Holohoax to you. You can find more info about them here:

    http://americanfreepress.net/?p=3342

    http://www.revisionists.com/revisionists/butz.html

    Either of those books will set you straight on what actually happened and what didn't happen during WWII concerning the Jews in Europe. I'll tell you right now: 6 million Jews were not murdered at the hands of the "Nazis". The "Nazis" wanted the Jews out of Germany (for good reason!) and made moves to accomplish this goal, which included arresting, relocating, and even facilitating the emigration of Jews to places other than Germany. The "death camps" were nothing more than industrial centers where Jews (and others) were forced to work. Now, please keep in mind that the international Jews declared war on Germany way back in 1933 shortly after Hitler came to power. Not only that, but the Jews had already completely subverted the German government, media, educational system, judicial system, etc. (just like America!). So clearly, the Jews were a threat to Germany, for obvious reasons. Also consider that Jews like Theodore Kaufman were openly calling for the complete destruction of the German nation. Take a look at this man:

    http://www.ihr.org/books/kaufman/perish.html

    WWII explained in a nutshell: the Jewish international banking criminal network that controlled the Allies - US, UK, USSR namely - ganged up on Adolf Hitler's Germany because he represented the greatest threat that has ever manifested itself in the past 200 years (at least) against the International Jewish Money Power. The Jews had to defeat Hitler, because he would have changed the world in a most profound way - in a genuinely good way.

    But that's another subject, feel free to email me if you want to talk about this. Click my name here and you can find my email. Or email Charlie and he will give you my email.

    I also suggested you seriously investigate 9/11, because there is overwhelming evidence suggesting Israel and a criminal network of Zionist Jews did 9/11 and blamed it on Muslims as a means to initiate the fraudulent "Global War on Terror". I have written about this on my blog extensively.

    http://johnfriendsblog.blogspot.com/

    Scroll down and look on the left hand side and you'll see a column titled "Israel did 9/11!" Check out those links man, it's obvious who did 9/11. That will lead you to explore other aspects of this crime gang. And yes, it is a Jewish crime gang, sorry to tell you bro. Judaism is a supremacist religion that is based on the Talmud, which not only sanctions but openly encourages the defrauding, lying to, cheating, and even killing non-Jews. I know you're not like that, but that is what Judaism is man, and if you're against that, you probably want to declare that publicly. And renounce the despicable Talmud.
    August 24, 2012 1:57 AM
Anonymous said...

    Butz's book is quite old by subject standards and has received some criticism from different quarters.

    Various language versions of materials on this subject here:
    http://www.aaargh.codoh.info/
    August 24, 2012 8:14 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    Hey John, sorry about confusing your name
    Thanks for the links, I'll try to take a look soon.

    I find the explanations you brought to the Jewish experience in WW2 quite bizarre.
    First, the number 6 million - perhaps it's not accurate, but it's roughly so. There where around 7.5 million Jews in Europe on the evening of WW2, and around less than 1.5 million when Hitler was defeated. Assuming a max 200 thousands natural deaths that would take place anyway, where did all these Jews gone?
    Second, claiming that the Nazis' goal was only to get rid of German Jews (a despicable goal in my opinion by itself) could not be true, since they have achieved this goal before the war - most German Jews left a bit before and a bit after the Nazis took power. There were hardly German Jewish victims in the holocaust, they all left before everything started. The Jewish victims of the Nazis were Jews living in other European countries, mostly eastern Europe.

    Calling Ghettos and concentration camps "industrial centers" should be as calling slaughterhouse amusement parks. Forced labor, slavery of millions of people (not only Jews) in horrible conditions resulted in hundreds of thousands of deaths. From 1942 on the final solution resulted in the conversion of the labor camps to death camps. This does not rely on testimonies of victims but on thousands of German Nazi testimonies, documents, pictures and films and data. One can always argue, however, that all the evidence is fake.

    About " the international Jews declared war on Germany" - are you talking about the American Jews' led boycott against Germany? This was the reaction of Jewish communities to the horrible anti-Jewish rhetoric and practices of the Nazis, and a very justified reaction. Too bad the Jews hadn't make more noise to force Western government to do more to save European Jews.
    There is no single documented Jewish attack against a single German person before WW2 started.

    About 9/11 - I still need to read the accusations to know the issue better, but the story of the "five Israelis dancing" is quite ridiculous as a proof of Israel's responsibility (it's amazing that no one blames the thousands of Palestinians who danced in the streets of Gaza at that day...). The Islamic Jihad organizations took responsibility and a lot of pride for the attacks. Are they all Israeli agents? Did the Israelis make the Islamic world work for them to attack Americans, and if they have so much power to control them, can't they make the Islamic world stop attacking Israelis??? And if the goal of Israel was to get Americans to fight terrorism that bothers them, wouldn't they prefer sending the Americans to fight Hamas and Hizbollah and Iran instead of terrorists in Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iraq that never got anywhere near an Israeli person?

    I resent the way the "truth movement" presents itself as a result of critical thinking in front of conventional thought. As you can see, there's a lot to hit back at the conspiracy theories. In any case, I'll try to learn the discourse better before the next round on Charlie's show
    August 24, 2012 8:53 AM
Anonymous said...

    http://wakeupfromyourslumber.com/blog/l ... would-they


    Despite the provocative title, check out the link and read on:
    "The Red Cross had unrestricted access each month to every German concentration camp including Auschwitz. They had inside men who reported to them in detail the activities at the camps.

    In a Nov. 22, 1944 letter to U.S. State Department officials, the Red Cross said: ..."
    August 24, 2012 9:42 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    @Anonymous,

    Regarding the red cross - go to Google Scholar (source for scientific publications) and search for red cross + holocaust, there are a few books and articles written on it, mostly from the late 1980s on. This is quite a studied issue. The Red Cross officials themselves released a few reports on their wrong conducts during WW2.

    Can anyone ever give me a link or title of something that is not an anonymous blog report, a youtube video made by "Zionistxxxblabla", and that actually has references to arguments??

    That blog article obviously sees that it doesn't have a case against the evidences for the holocaust, so it goes to speak about Israel, Iran, all kinds of manipulations that enables the writer to say "look, these people are doing so many bad things, don't believe them". Ridiculous.
    August 24, 2012 10:06 AM
Anonymous said...

    Google Scholar, in as much as it is inevitably filtered according to subjective criteria, is a false paradigm for objective searches. Please include in your research all potential sources including the many books on the site already quoted (which will take you much time to peruse and read, if you are genuinely interested in surveying the literature):

    http://www.aaargh.codoh.info/

    from which site I note at random among others:

    1) http://www.aaargh.codoh.info/fran/livres3/HoaxV2.pdf
    Arthur R. Butz: "The Hoax of the Tentieth Century" (an early book in the field, I think there are as stated one or more books also criticising some aspects of its content in light of later research).

    2) http://www.aaargh.codoh.info/fran/livre ... oodeng.pdf
    Richard E. Harwood (pseud. of BNP member Richard Verrall?): "Did Six Million Really Die?"

    -wherefrom:

    http://theunjustmedia.com/holocaust/Did ... %20con.htm
    "Did Six Million Really Die?"
    Chapters 9,10 & Conclusion


    "There is one survey of the Jewish question in Europe during World War Two and the conditions of Germany's concentration camps which is almost unique in its honesty and objectivity, the three-volume Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its Activities during the Second World War (Geneva, 1948).
    ...
    In dealing with this comprehensive, three-volume Report, it is important to stress that the delegates of the International Red Cross found no evidence whatsoever of 'gas chambers'. The original 1946 edition did not even talk of 'extermination' or 'death camps' but after the emotional impact of the Nuremberg trials the Red Cross felt compelled to introduce into the expanded 1948 Report several, very cursory references to 'death camps' (Vol. 1 p. 641) and 'extermination camps' (Vol. I p. 645).

    However, no means of 'extermination' is indicated. In all its 1,600 pages the three-volume Report does not even mention such a thing as a 'gas chamber'. It acknowledges that Jews, like many other wartime nationalities, suffered rigours and privations, but its complete silence on the subject of 'gassings' is ample refutation of the 'Holocaust' legend."

    http://books.google.com/books/about/Rep ... 4JAQAAIAAJ

    No full view. No downoad.


    http://www.icrc.org/eng/resources/docum ... 57jnwr.htm

    "Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its activities during the Second World War", three volumes and an annex, ICRC, Geneva, 1948.

    Vol.I, " General activities " , 736 pp.
    Vol. II, " The Central Agency for Prisoners of War " , 320 pp.
    Vol. III, " Relief activities " , 539 pp.
    Annexes, 69 pp.

    http://www.worldcat.org/title/report-of ... lc/1654802

    Not found for purchase on http://www.bookfinder.com

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Report-Internat ... B0018XY4PK

    "Currently unavailable.
    We don't know when or if this item will be back in stock."



    The ICRC also published its: "Work of the International Committee of the Red Cross for Civilian Detainees in German Concentration Camps"

    http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=TNrr ... hJbE&hl=en

    Mysteriously, also not found for purchase on http://www.bookfinder.com

    ...cont'd...
    August 24, 2012 5:26 PM
Anonymous said...

    ...continuing and concluding...


    John Sack in his 1995 book "An Eye for an Eye: The Story of Jews Who Sought Revenge For the Holocaust"

    http://home.us.archive.org/details/AnEyeForAnEye

    quotes the ICRC's "Work of the International Committee of the Red Cross for Civilian Detainees in German Concentration Camps" and implies the ICRC did not have access to Auschwitz (printed page 111; see also bottom of printed page 212). That does not seem to be borne out by the narrated content of the 3-vol. ICRC Report. (Incidentally, see also printed page 214 of Sack about post-WW2 German deaths in Polish camps and prisons). However from a quick search I find no mention by him of the authoritative 3-volume ICR Report. Why?

    The starting point for an informed discussion should surely include at least the 3-volume ICRC Report yet it seems to be nearly unobtainable, at least online and/or in hard copy for personal purchase.

    That is all from me. Not my subject.
    August 24, 2012 5:27 PM
Jan Mueller said...

    @Anonymous,

    Thanks particularly for the "The Hoax of the Tentieth Century" pdf, I couldn't get the book in Germany and didn't know it's available online. I'll take a look, since as I understood it gives the revisionist story to a maximum extent.

    Regarding the Red Cross report - it should be clear, logically, that whatever was known 2-3 years after WW2 about the holocaust is not (in quantity nor quality) what is known to researchers today. It took time to get the German archive documents (most of them were available only in the 1970s) and to establish a credible research on the events of the holocaust.

    The Red Cross has admitted in the 1990s that it has been concealing information on the Holocaust (http://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/19/us/re ... e-war.html), and that it had a "moral failure" on that matter (http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1 ... 62,1339920)

    The nature of research on war crimes and genocide is that it takes time to reveal the truth. The perpetrators hide information, testimonies are conflicting, and most people involved (both perpetrators and victims!) don't want to talk about it. We still don't know all there is to know about the holocaust, and there are many documents and testimonies that have not been examined properly.

    Even if the Red Cross wanted to find out about the gas chambers in 1946, it is indeed possible that it could not find out about them. At that time, research was just in its beginning, and even access to Auschwitz was not easy to obtain.

    I also read an accusation about Mauthausen, that in the beginning someone said that 2 million people died there. Now we know more and the estimates speak about around 100 thousands, with a minority of Jewish victims. This is acknowledged by holocaust conventional scholars, so I find it a bit strange that the initial mistake serves as a proof that the holocaust is a "hoax" - the estimated numbers of Jewish victims do not include 2 million victims in Mauthausen, but around 20 thousands.

    Now we know more. The Red Cross today acknowledges the extermination of European Jews and others by the Nazis.
    The Germans acknowledge the extermination.
    The vast majority of scholars, most of whom are not Jewish, continue to reveal more information about the holocaust.
    August 24, 2012 6:26 PM
http://www.LindseyNarrates.wordpress.com said...

    You people may be getting fooled by this Hasbara Troll, but I will not accept his sweet-words with poisonous intent. If you can not see that his intention is to play the "good cop" role and make it seem like he actually is "open" to learning the truths as they are, then you people who are falling for this are just throwing-out all that you have learned about the tricks and the traps of these "people" that we have seen played upon the human-race over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

    Fuck that.

    I stand ABSOLUTELY by what I believe is happening with this "Jan" and if you can not see it, it is because you are just being snookered by his approach. Regardless of the approach, know that this Hasbarat has an agenda, and it is obviously working.

    DESPICABLE.

    Lindsey
    August 25, 2012 5:49 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    Lindsey,

    You should really relax a bit.. Even if I am a Hasbara Troll, I have so far reacted to your arguments with counter arguments. I'm here to have a dialogue, and that does not include only hearing what you have to say but also making you hear what I have to say. And I do have something to say on your perspective of the world, which is very different from mine.

    It's not a "good cop" strategy, there is no strategy. I do not agree with the vast majority of people with my perspective of Israel and the Jewish people, who are not interesting in having any dialogue with those who demonize and delegitimize them, those who spread lies on them and those who wish to destroy them. I am affiliated with those people and I understand them, but I disagree with their "look away" method of dealing with it.
    I want to learn your theories and your arguments. I am not doing this so that I will become one of you, and do have and will have a lot to say against that.

    If you are confident in your beliefs about Zionism and the Jewish people, you should not have any problem with having a real dialogue and discussion with me, and not one in which we call each other in names and titles.

    What are you afraid of?

    Jan.
    August 25, 2012 6:33 AM
Arminius said...

    The HoloHoax by David Cole, Jewish Truth Seeker

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSKNUEBp ... r_embedded

    ------------------

    Holohoax Survivors who Tell the Truth

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbBMJiBR ... r_embedded
    August 25, 2012 7:06 AM
Arminius said...

    Germany to pay an extra $300 million to holohoax suvivors.

    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/157704

    The holohoax is a big fooking lie, Jan. How dare you call yourself German while your fellow jew rats extort billions from the German taxpayer. You jews suck dirty ass.

    Jews Demand A Jewish State Within Germany

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOP7h7C8j_0
    August 25, 2012 7:15 AM
Arminius said...

    The following quotes were taken from "Hitler Speaks: A Series of Political Conversations With Adolf Hitler on His Real Aims" By Hermann Rauschning, 1st edition, 1939

    "Leave the hair-splitting to others. Whether it's the Old Testament or the New, or simply the sayings of Jesus, it's all the same old Jewish swindle. It will not make us free. A German church, a German Christianity is a distortion. One is either a German or a Christian. You cannot be both."

    "Hitler made it clear that he was not interested in an "Aryanized Christianity" or the "Aryan Jesus" myth promoted by Houston Stewart Chamberlain, Von Liebenfels, and certain party members. "You cannot make an Aryan out of Jesus, that's nonsense. What needs to be done you say? I will tell you: we must prevent the churches from doing anything but, what they are doing now, that is, losing ground day by day. But we can hasten matters. The parsons will be made to dig their own graves." he stated."

    "The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew." - Adolf Hitler

    http://spiritualwarfare666.webs.com/Hit ... ianity.htm
    August 25, 2012 7:19 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    @Arminius,

    I watched parts of that David Cole video a day before the debate on Charles' show. The major flaw in his video is that the case for the gas chambers does not rely on the knowledge of one tour guide at Auschwitz. The answer to every question he raises there exists, all he needed to do is to find them.

    That's actually a very common theme in holocaust-revisionist articles: completely ignoring the vast majority of works on the holocaust to raise questions that are seemingly new or unanswered in a manipulative manner. For example, I read about the issue that in the beginning they said that 3 millions died in Auschwitz, and later the number has changed to 1.3 millions, so it "proves" that they lied.
    But the initial number 3 million was based on the testimony of the Nazi commander of Auschwitz! The Nazis claimed that they exterminated 3 million people in Auschwitz, not the holocaust scholars! Later on, with the advance of studies and testimonies, a more accurate picture was obtained.
    August 25, 2012 7:38 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    About "Germany to pay an extra $300 million to holohoax suvivors":

    Sounds to me like good news, that Germany compensates its victims. That's what a responsible government should be doing.

    About "Jews Demand A Jewish State Within Germany" -
    Hate makes people look for excuses to justify their hate. The "Weimar Jewish State" campaign is an art project of Israeli and German art students. It's not a real political movement... read about it here: (in German, use google translate or something..)
    http://www.dradio.de/dkultur/sendungen/ ... t/1679985/
    August 25, 2012 7:44 AM
Arminius said...

    I'm going to recommend that Charlie not give you another second on air to promote your big jew lie. You jews are all the same, you're not interested in truth. Israel is not a piece of land, Israel is a name that jew god gave to Jacob in the jew book aka the buybull.

    Read Eli the jew Ravage if you have any decency which you don't, you're a jew between the ears.

    You have not begun to appreciate the real depth of our guilt. We are intruders. We are disturbers. We are subverters. We have taken your natural world, your ideals, your destiny, and played havoc with them. We have been at the bottom not merely of the latest great war but of nearly all your wars, not only of the Russian but of every other major revolution in your history. We have brought discord and confusion and frustration into your personal and public life. We are still doing it. No one can tell how long we shall go on doing it.

    http://www.bbsradio.com/cgi-bin/webbbs/ ... d;id=25835
    August 25, 2012 8:02 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    @Arminius,

    I am very sorry that you're attempting to silence me. I am very interested in continuing talking with Charlie and all of you.

    You're calling me a liar. Can you give one example of a lie I have written or told?

    I find your argument that "Israel is not a land because it's a name given to a person" quite bizarre. Should we also say that America is not a land because it's a name given to a person (heard of Amerigo Vespucci?)
    Common, stick to some reasoned arguments.

    And I'm very happy that you brought a quote from Eli Ravage's 1928 article. Too bad you failed to understand it - the author makes fun of Jew-haters. It's a satire, and he's showing how ridiculous and paradoxical arguments against Jews are. The author fought against anti-Semitism most of his life.
    I recommend reading the entire article, it's a very good one!

    August 25, 2012 8:17 AM
Arminius said...

    your only defense is to call me a jew-hater.

    Like I said, you jews are all the same, you have no decency in you and all you do is lie.

    August 25, 2012 8:24 AM
Arminius said...

    The Aryan super genius Nikolai Tesla said it all in one tiny quote.

    Nikolai Tesla to his secretary: "Miss! Never trust a jew!"
    August 25, 2012 8:27 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    @Arminius,

    I think that anyone reading this thread can see that I was the one the one bringing rational arguments and all you did was to make false accusations, to insult me and to call me a liar without providing a single evidence.

    I'm not going to insult you back, I'm not here for that.

    Best,
    Jan
    August 25, 2012 8:32 AM
Arminius said...

    LOl, you truth-hater!
    August 25, 2012 8:34 AM
Arminius said...

    The Origins of Holocaustianity started by Jewish extremists

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5V3PdeNP ... 1345901144
    August 25, 2012 8:59 AM
Jan Mueller said...

    Arminius,

    you're not so good in dialogue or a civilized discussion, I'm afraid.

    Can I ask you something (that is, expect an answer that isn't just one big insult to me personally..) - what should be done with the Jews?
    August 25, 2012 12:09 PM
Lindsey said...

    Arminius, DO NOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION BECAUSE ALL THAT HE IS TRYING TO DO IS BAIT YOU.

    Do not feed the trolls. How difficult is it to see what is happening here? This guy does this on YouTube/ADL, he did it on Charles' show when he didn't answer the questions and then jumped to another issue/topic, and he will do it whenever and wherever else a serious discussion is taking-place where facts are facts and common-sense and HISTORY REPEATING ITSELF OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, can be ignored because that is what these "people" do best.

    Guys, I recommend taking this discussion to http://www.theinfounderground.com/forum and discussing it there because this is really not the place for what I see happening.

    "Jan" I would not have a problem with you if you did not basically say that nothing will change your mind, if you did not say that it is OK for Germany to keep giving more and more and more and more money and resources over events that have been categorically shown to be anything but what happened, and if you were HONEST about what your people are doing to Palestinians, and BY EXTENSION, THE REST OF THE HUMAN-RACE BECAUSE ALL OF US KNOW THAT THE INTENT IS TO CREATE A jewish-UTOPIA WHERE MOST OF THE HUMAN-RACE IS GONE AND THE SURVIVORS ARE SLAVES WHERE THE "chosen" ARE GODS-WALKING-ON-EARTH. Brother, NONE OF US are going to ever lie to ourselves that this is not the intention at the very end of all that is happening to our planet, and if you think that you are going to be able to smooth-talk your way into convincing those of us who have seen the evidence of what is intended, then you truly are delusional.

    I'll tell you what...read this essay and then TRY to refute it, and then we will have something to discuss when you are on Charles' show. I am not an asshole and I AM willing to have a conversation with those who are willing to have a conversation and are not trying to obfuscate or have any other malevolent agenda.

    viewtopic.php?f=6&t=16662&p=67453&sid=707e6e7bf2ab12948020df21fbf5f04b#p67453

    Read it, critique it, and if you are not convinced of the reality that we are all facing--those of us who are goyim, I should say--then there really is nothing that will convince you.

    Lindsey
    August 25, 2012 1:07 PM
Lindsey said...

    I forgot to add that the essay is the ZionCrimeFactory master-piece, "The jew World Order Unmasked" also known as "The jew World Order Is Upon Us, BEWARE!"

    I decided to permanently archive it at TIU, which is something that I should have immediately done many months ago, because it is seemingly not available anywhere but his website, which, AGAIN, is down thanks to the demons walking-on-two-legs at the ADL/jDL/jIDF, etc., etc.

    Lindsey
    August 25, 2012 1:10 PM
Jan Mueller said...

    Lindsey,

    I accept your challenge - I will read your article and write some comments (though it's quite long so I am not sure I'll manage to get through everything by Tuesday).
    I will post my comments and send you, and I expect us to debate in a civilized and rational manner in Tuesday, without you calling me names or insulting me as you have done obsessively so far.

    I see that you took quite hard my saying that my opinion will not be changed. Maybe it was a bit extreme to say it, since I have changed my opinion about many things in the past. The issue is, that your case against the Jews (As a general case by which "Jews are evil and responsible for everything that is bad in the world", and as general cases in particular issues) is EXTREMELY WEAK.

    Frankly, I am very disappointing by what I find out so far. I assumed that if so many books and articles were written on, for example, the "holocaust hoax", there are at least some rational arguments that should be considered there. I'm very disappointing to see that there is probably no case against the holocaust at all. This is my impression so far, and I think that my comments on this thread to the sources I was given serve as a good example for that. Everything you argue is built on unrepresentative quotes taken out of context (or fake, or misunderstood), that even if they were true and representative they don't prove anything to any argument that is presented here against the Jews. So I'm disappointed...
    August 25, 2012 2:01 PM
Lindsey said...

    Jan, this is NOT my "theory" about what is happening to our planet; this comes directly from the jews themselves.

    I know that you would not be able to read this in its entirety because of its length, but this is from where I got the term, "jewish-Utopia." This book was written by someone basically bragging about what is intended for the planet, and after I read this I finally understood that the human-race is truly under-attack.

    Look, this is not the place for this; if a discussion is to take place of any kind, it needs to go to http://www.theinfounderground.com/forum because this is simply not a good venue.

    Lindsey

    NB: Jan, you can easily read "The jew World Order Unmasked" in a couple of hours, and if you want, you can translate it to German or Hebrew, whichever you choose.
    August 25, 2012 3:16 PM
Lindsey said...

    http://iamthewitness.com/books/The-Ulti ... a-1957.pdf



    "THE JEWISH UTOPIA", discovered by the author in
    an unlisted Jewish collection in the library of the University of
    Texas, is the authentic and complete plan of the Zionists for
    world domination. It pictures the ultimate "new social order"
    which the Zionists hope to establish after they have used Communism,
    democracy and a third world war to gain their ends.
    THE ULTIMATE WORLD ORDER is an analysis of "The
    Jewish Utopia", with photographs and excerpts from the original
    text.
    The Ultimate World Order
    — as Pictured in "The Jewish Utopia"
    The Communist plan for rubbing out all national, religious, cultural
    and racial lines and submerging the world in formless, characterless chaos
    for easy domination is grandiose enough. To say that there is still another,
    If Communism is only temporary, what is to be the ultimate novus
    ordo seclorum, the new order, of society if the successors to the Jewish revolutionaries,
    Marx and Heine, accomplish their aim? Who are to be the
    masters of the new order and what do they want to do with our children
    and grandchildren?
    It goes without saying that no man can escape concern about such a
    scheme if it has powerful backing.
    For years I have felt that somewhere there must be a master plan
    showing what Heine and his fellow planners had in mind for us, after the
    fires of Communism burn away the heritages of the various races and cultures,
    religions and nations; after Communist monsters have killed out
    I have never seen anything comparable; for this small book sketches the general outlines of the ultimate goal hundreds of years ahead, toward which all the various activities of the Zionists and their "liberal" dupes are,
    wittingly or unwittingly, contributing. ZIONISM FROM TALMUD AND TORAH.

    Yet, the book was not marked secret; it was in plain English and in the Library of the University of Texas. (And a friend has found a copy in the Library of Congress, Washington, D.C., supposedly a copy which was filed with application for copyright in 1932.)
    If the book is not marked secret, if it is in plain English, it is nevertheless
    almost safe, for it is largely couched in the esoteric language which all Jewish revolutionaries have used throughout known history, language found even in their Torah, (the Books of Moses) and which Jewish writers imparted to Communist literature. Their use of words which you and I take
    to mean one thing but which their followers understand as meaning something else, a system which our people little suspect, almost guarantees the security of the document.
    Here at last is the complete plan of the Zionists, in their own words, for world domination.

    The author speaks of "the righteous" and "the just". He says they shall inherit the earth. He quotes the Prophets, the Books of Moses, etc. Who would suspect that he had political revolution and total conquest in mind?"

    Jan, you really need to face-the-reality of what IS happening to our planet, what HAS happened in the past, and what WILL inevitably happen if these psychopaths and demons walking-on-two-legs get all that they want; Jan, this will be a LITERAL Hell-on-Earth, and that is the painful and ugly truth that the brain-washing has kept from the majority of the human-race.

    Lindsey
    August 25, 2012 3:28 PM
Jan Mueller said...

    Lindsey,

    I fail to understand the important discovery or plot in the book "Jewish Utopia". It was written by Michael Higger, a Jewish Talmud-Scholar (studied the Talmud), who was for a period a scholar at Colombia University. The book is not secretive or "unlisted", it's a known publication that analyzes the envisioned individual and social life according to the Jewish philosophical thought. There's a Wiki on the author in Hebrew (http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%9E%D7% ... 7%92%D7%A8).

    He is not so known and the book is listed in the Israeli national library in Jerusalem. I guess that the number of people in Israel who read this book does not exceed 100...

    The accusation that this book is some kind of evil plot for Zionism (the liberation movement of the Jewish people that achieved an independent Jewish state in 1948..) seems like something that is not based on any reason or evidence. It's a philosophic book by a scholar, not a practical guide for anything. Zionism was a secular movement that couldn't care less about the Talmud. The Talmud itself is a complex series of books that Rabbis and Scholars study and investigate for many years, and the notion that someone like me or you can read it and understand what it's about immediately is absurd.

    I'm sorry to burst your bubble - there is no "Zionist conspiracy to ruin the world". There's only a Zionist conspiracy to keep the tiny state of Israel alive.
    August 25, 2012 4:30 PM
Anonymous said...

    To Man Jeweler,
    Can you hook me up with a deal on some diamonds. Thanks so much!
    August 25, 2012 7:48 PM
Arminius said...

    For Jan the lying rat faced jew bastard.

    The Origins of Holocaustianity started by Jewish extremists

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5V3PdeNP ... r_embedded


    And for Lindsey, stfu you christarded jew worshiping kweer. Don't tell me how to be, who the f do you think you are? If I want to answer his baiting question that's my f'n business.

    And what the f is your problem, how come you can't let go of the jew fairy tale? Do you still "believe" in santa and the easter bunny, too?

    What do we do with the jews? Hmmm, I'm guessing lindsey thinks the majick invisible jew in the sky is going to punish his naughty chosen in the near future, so, like jewsus says: Resist not the evil one, if the evil one smites your left cheek then turn to him the other so he can smite that one also, then give the evil jew your shirt and coat and, and, and. Give the evil jew everything you own and store up treasures in jew heaven. (rolls eyes)

    Okay, an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth. The commie jews are responsible for over 200 million gentile goyim cattle being murdered in the last century alone. How many rat faced kike bastard jews are there in the world today? The rat faced kike bastard jews say there are somewhere around 17 million jew rats in the world today. Even using jew math the answer is clear, 200 million goyim is surely worth 17 million kikes. Sorry jews, facts are facts.

    Let's start with Jan the lying little jew rat bastard, in the oven jew, schnell, schnell juden ratte. Lol, just kidding.
    August 26, 2012 5:10 AM
Arminius said...

    Chew on this one jewboy.

    Filthy jew rabbi to face criminal charges for botched circucision in Germany.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... 3AOTYfqsSI
    August 26, 2012 6:27 AM
Arminius said...

    Abortion: the kosher slaughter

    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xkyon5 ... erial_news

    ---------------

    The Nazi Connection

    GLORIA STEINEM

    Cofounder and editor of Ms. Magazine, Gloria Steinem's views on "The Nazi Connection" are based on her research on international feminism done at the Woodrow Wilson Center of the Smithsonian Institution.

    (snip) Hitler himself, and the Nazi doctrine he created, were unequivocally opposed to any individual right to abortion.

    In 1933, feminists were removed from teaching and other public posts by the same law that removed "non-Aryans" from such jobs. All women were banned from the Reichstag, from judgeships, and from other decision-making posts.

    Under Hitler, choosing abortion became sabotage; a crime punishable by hard labor for the woman and a possible death penalty for the abortionist.

    http://www.harvardsquarelibrary.org/spe ... einem.html
    August 26, 2012 6:35 AM
Goyanim said...

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1819950.html

    Yoram Haimi, Israeli Archaeologist, Digs Into Nazi's Sobibor Death Camp
    "I feel like I am an investigator in a criminal forensic laboratory," Haimi, 51, said near his home in southern Israel this week, a day before departing for another dig in Poland. "After all, it is a murder scene."
    Over five years of excavations, Haimi has been able to remap the camp and has unearthed thousands of items. He hasn't found anything about his family, but amid the teeth, bone shards and ashes through which he has sifted, he has recovered jewelry, keys and coins that have helped identify some of Sobibor's formerly nameless victims.
    The heavy concentration of ashes led him to estimate that far more than 250,000 Jews were actually killed at Sobibor.

    Exterminationists like to say that revisionists ignore facts and evidence, that if time travel was invented and used to indisputably prove a German extermination program to kill Jews, revisionists would still ignore it. This sets up revisionists to be crackpot deniers who deny everything in light of the evidence which is not true.

    What evidence?

    Here we have another 'archeologist' digging at 'Sobibor' wildly claiming to have found a heavy concentration of ashes without any evidence to back up his claim. They've been digging here for over a decade and Andrzej Kola made this claim several years ago and failed to publish the evidence claiming the Polish government hadn't paid him.
    Haimi's claims are outrageous: http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/7518/img0170kj3.jpg

    The above photo is alleged to show the area of 5 of the alleged 7 "huge mass graves" found by Kola. They are now trying to say that the round monument also covers two "unseen" mass graves.

    As to the alleged huge mass graves "visible" in the photo, here is what Yoram has to say:
    "Concerning the 'huge white mound' in the photo - this is a polished monument which partially covers the remains of ash and human bone fragments (the mass grave). In the photo you should be able to make out three green concentrations of ash and human bone fragments located beyond the monument."
    And later says:
    "because this is a memorial monument on the area of the 5 mass grave."

    http://forum.codoh.info/viewtopic.php?t=5106

    There is more email exchanges with Haimi in the above link where he admits this photo shows all of the mass graves even though there are no mass graves in the photo nor are there green concentrations of of ash and bone.

    If they found mass graves of ash and bone, how come no forensic/DNA analysis is being performed? How do they know they are Jewish? The orthodox exterminationist narrative claims that it was 'mostly Jews' who were exterminated at Sobibor. Mostly Jews does not mean all Jews. Haimi's comment that "far more than 250,000 Jews were actually killed at Sobibor" is quite an outrageous claim indeed because the orthodox narrative claims 200k-250k total people were killed. Mostly Jews but NOT all Jews.

    For something they make out to be so historically important, these investigations are shoddy. This is also a biased (and brainwashed) researcher because he is an Israeli. You can tell by that 'far more than 250,000' remark which ignorantly ignores the orthodox narrative's goyim. And speaking of goyim, how come when they investigate these things the evidence is ignored but when an Israeli investigates it and makes bold claims without providing evidence they accept it as fact?
    August 26, 2012 3:09 PM
Arminius said...

    That's the jew way, Goyanim.

    Look above as Jan the jew tries to explain away David Cole's (a jew himself) incriminating evidence.

    Not a single jew was gassed by the Nazis.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsrPt-enplw
    August 26, 2012 3:24 PM
Jan Mueller said...

    Goyanim,

    Here's the scientific article Yoram was writing at the time you (or something else) bothered him with questions:
    http://presentpasts.info/index.php/pp/a ... ew/pp.12/2

    Please send this link to whoever is interested in knowing about Sobibor death camp.

    Thank you for your interest in the Jewish people's history.

    Best,
    Jan
    August 26, 2012 5:19 PM
Arminius said...

    Final Solution To The German Question Published More Than 2 Years BEFORE Alleged "Holocaust"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qj-WX3_v ... playnext=3
    August 26, 2012 10:52 PM"

[zapoper]

Just in case you don't believe Lindsey, this is the particular thread lol http://grizzom.blogspot.ca/2012/08/trut ... l#comments

[Wimpy]

A short summary of dialogue:


Zapoper:  It's a good thing that Lindsey called in to point out the Israeli accent. I was so busy listening to that guy dancing around the subject without really addressing it that I didn't even notice the accent.

Lindsey may be right about him. He may very well be Hasbara.

Jan: First, thank you for listening and calling. I could not understand the accusation against me for being a "Hasbara troll" or something like that - I think that I was pretty sincere about my background and my affiliation.

Jan:  Lindsey, thank you for the sources you suggested. The books on the holocaust "hoax" are not available in Germany and I have no way to obtain them (unless I order from Amazon UK but then it's quite expensive..).

John: Five Links of Books and Articles RE: Holohoax.

Jan:  I find the explanations you brought to the Jewish experience in WW2 quite bizarre.
First, the number 6 million - perhaps it's not accurate, but it's roughly so. There where around 7.5 million Jews in Europe on the evening of WW2, and around less than 1.5 million when Hitler was defeated.

Jan: Can anyone ever give me a link or title of something that is not an anonymous blog report, a youtube video made by "Zionistxxxblabla", and that actually has references to arguments??

Anon:  List of Holohoax Books.....A list of 17 Books and Subject Links!

Jan:  Thanks particularly for the "The Hoax of the Tentieth Century" pdf, I couldn't get the book in Germany and didn't know it's available online. I'll take a look, since as I understood it gives the revisionist story to a maximum extent.

Regarding the Red Cross report - it should be clear, logically, that whatever was known 2-3 years after WW2 about the holocaust is not (in quantity nor quality) what is known to researchers today. .........................

The Red Cross has admitted in the 1990s that it has been concealing information on the Holocaust (http://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/19/us/re ... e-war.html), and that it had a "moral failure" on that matter (http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1 ... 62,1339920)

Arminius: Germany to pay an extra $300 million to holohoax suvivors.


Jan: About "Germany to pay an extra $300 million to holohoax suvivors":

Sounds to me like good news, that Germany compensates its victims. That's what a responsible government should be doing.

Lindsey:  You people may be getting fooled by this Hasbara Troll, but I will not accept his sweet-words with poisonous intent. If you can not see that his intention is to play the "good cop" role and make it seem like he actually is "open" to learning the truths as they are, then you people who are falling for this are just throwing-out all that you have learned about the tricks and the traps of these "people" that we have seen played upon the human-race over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

Jan:  I want to learn your theories and your arguments. I am not doing this so that I will become one of you, and do have and will have a lot to say against that.

If you are confident in your beliefs about Zionism and the Jewish people, you should not have any problem with having a real dialogue and discussion with me, and not one in which we call each other in names and titles.

What are you afraid of?

Arminius: Five more Links including three Youtube vids.

Jan:  I watched parts of that David Cole video a day before the debate on Charles' show. The major flaw in his video is that the case for the gas chambers does not rely on the knowledge of one tour guide at Auschwitz. The answer to every question he raises there exists, all he needed to do is to find them.

That's actually a very common theme in holocaust-revisionist articles: completely ignoring the vast majority of works on the holocaust to raise questions that are seemingly new or unanswered in a manipulative manner...

Arminius:  I'm going to recommend that Charlie not give you another second on air to promote your big jew lie. You jews are all the same, you're not interested in truth. Israel is not a piece of land, Israel is a name that jew god gave to Jacob in the jew book aka the buybull.

Jan:  I am very sorry that you're attempting to silence me. I am very interested in continuing talking with Charlie and all of you....

Linsey:   Arminius, DO NOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION BECAUSE ALL THAT HE IS TRYING TO DO IS BAIT YOU.

Jan:  Frankly, I am very disappointing by what I find out so far. I assumed that if so many books and articles were written on, for example, the "holocaust hoax", there are at least some rational arguments that should be considered there. I'm very disappointing to see that there is probably no case against the holocaust at all. This is my impression so far, and I think that my comments on this thread to the sources I was given serve as a good example for that. Everything you argue is built on unrepresentative quotes taken out of context (or fake, or misunderstood), that even if they were true and representative they don't prove anything to any argument that is presented here against the Jews. So I'm disappointed...

Summary: No case against against the Holohoax though over 20 Links to Articles, Books and Videos were furnished.  Chutzpah! And I see a new tactic of feigned reason as opposed to shrill accusations of Anti-Semitism & Jew Hater.

[jan]

Indeed, no case against the truthfulness of the extensive knowledge we have on the systematic murder of six million Jews by Nazi Germany. The case holocaust revisionism presents is extremely weak, relies on anecdotes and distortion of historical facts. According to revisionism, every document or evident to the holocaust was fabricated by "the Jews" or by people who are "controlled by the Jews". This is the only answer to tens of thousands of documents, testimonies (of both victims and perpetrators!), and many empirical findings from concentration and death camps. Yet, not a single evidence that anyone ever forged any of these evidences is presented. Not even one.

The evidences that are presented to support the allegation that the tragic events are a "hoax" are extremely weak and embarrassing. I should admit that I was probably not exposed yet to all of them, though I believe I "got the picture" by now, and it's a very bad one. A conversation with a tour guide in Auschwitz about the door of a gas chamber does not refute the evidences that they existed, including admission of the companies involved, and plans and documentation exposed by Nazi leaders and the German archive. Trying to refute the existence of gas chambers is one of the most embarrassing things that revisionists do to themselves, which prevent any logical person in the west to ever take anything they produce seriously. I would strongly suggest the obsessive campaigners to drop this issue. Even that Jewish kid David Cole eventually admitted he was stupid to argue against the gas chambers.

The argument that at the beginning they said 3 million and then changed it to 1.3 million deaths in Auschwitz is also very weak - the original number was based on the testimony of Auschwitz commander in Nuremberg, and holocaust scholars estimate the number to be around 1.3 million. This is not a "revelation" that there were 1.3 instead of 3, this is what they scholars are saying.
Then there are the weird anecdotes of a piano in the concentration camp (maybe there was one... why not?), A document of the Red Cross saying they didn't hear anything (like the majority of Germans and Polish said and continue to say even 20 years after), and other nonsense about "Jews declaring war on Germany" (the very justified economic boycott against the Nazis in 1933), and the one Jewish writer Kaufman who wanted the German people that killed his entire family to get the hell out of this planet (and didn't even bother to punch a German person).

All these ridiculous anecdotes stand against tens of thousands of scientific articles of various disciplines exposing hundreds of thousands of stories with detailed information, documentation, and irrefutable evidences, and even to this day dozens of holocaust research centers in the leading universities around the world continue to employ thousands of scholars and graduate students revealing more and more about the horrible tragedy of the Jewish people, and other people who were persecuted by the Nazi monster.
You can start with this list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bibliograp ... _Holocaust
And then continue to this list that contains a few thousands academic publications, all of course "fake by the Jewish (fill in your own slur here)":
http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/cgi/viewcont ... ext=clcweb

Tomorrow in Charlie's show I hope we can discuss about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and not about this issue, this is what Charlie wanted and I hope to cooperate with him on that.
Looking forward to a dignified discussion and dialogue,
Jan

[Wimpy]

Indeed, no case against the truthfulness of the extensive knowledge we have on the systematic murder of six million Jews by Nazi Germany. The case holocaust revisionism presents is extremely weak, relies on anecdotes and distortion of historical facts. According to revisionism, every document or evident to the holocaust was fabricated by "the Jews" or by people who are "controlled by the Jews". This is the only answer to tens of thousands of documents, testimonies (of both victims and perpetrators!), and many empirical findings from concentration and death camps. Yet, not a single evidence that anyone ever forged any of these evidences is presented. Not even one.

-Jan

Please furnish your Tens of Thousands of documents and your sources, including Author.  You have supplied nothing, while others supplied information that you dismissed without a reasoned, logical, sourced and a directly pertinent response.  And, yes, it is quite valid to suggest your sources are Jewish and that these sources could very well be biased.

It is also quite pertinent if the sources, and you as well, take the annual Kol Nidre oath.  This would establish a phenomenal credibility gap at the on-set of any truthful and "logical" discussion.

[jan]

Wimpy,

I have actually provided links and explanations of the distorted arguments presented to me by sources that are way beyond "biased" - sources that are entirely about demonizing the Jewish people and promoting hate and bigotry. If you think that I haven't refuted a particular argument well enough, let me know which one and I will try again.
The "Jewish sources" I have, tends of thousands of academic publications, documents and testimonies of both Jewish victims and Nazi perpetrators, cannot be contrasted with the bunch of speculations you have on "that's not the suitable door for a gas chamber", or "a Jewish woman said there was a piano in the ghetto", or "there can't be holocaust because a Jewish author in the US wrote that he doesn't like the Germans" or other nonsense you produce in masses and spread obsessively.
Where are the fabricated documents? can you name on that is fabricated? the Wannsee protocols are fabricated? the testimony of Rudolf Hass is fabricated? Who fabricated all this, when and how? give some information about the "truth" you're so convinced about, instead of leaving us only with ridiculous anecdotes and speculations and that Jew in 1928 saying he's not that fund of the Goyim who treat his people like crap for centuries. Show me the truth, enlighten me with more than some stupid stories and endless slurs! Why are you concealing all your evidences? what are you waiting for?

Revisionism is a joke, but it's not a funny one, it's sad and pathetic, and it hurts a lot of people that I don't wish you to ever be one of them.

[Wimpy]

Revisionism is a joke, but it's not a funny one, it's sad and pathetic, and it hurts a lot of people that I don't wish you to ever be one of them.

-Jan

Please elaborate on my Bold emphasis of your quote.  I am not quite sure how you intend the word "hurt".

Are you familiar with David Irving-Author & Historian?

[LordLindsey]

These are two excellent sites on proof of the lack-of-evidence of gas-chambers, not to mention how absurd it is that WORK-CAMPS would ever be considered to be DEATH-CAMPS.

http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... nated.html

http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... 6d081f0459

Here is something that is very interesting about that "MAGICAL-NUMBER:"

http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... or-to.html

Here is ZionCrimeFactory's MASTER-PIECE on the h0l0c0$t that is a must-read because it is what it is...

http://servv89pn0aj.sn.sourcedns.com/~g ... ndex1.html  It is entitled "The Six Million Myth"

allow me to quote just a tad from it:

"The mythical "Six Million" figure has intriguing origins indeed. Jews have staunchly emphasized the 6,000,000 figure in atrocity propaganda from the years 1890 through 1945. World War II ended in 1945, and since that time the cabalistic 6,000,000 figure has now reached sacrosanct status. This was achieved through a sleazy and deceptive campaign of repetitive HoloHoax swindlespeak in the news and entertainment media, centered in Jewish Hollywood. As the Jewish-Communist mass murderer, Vladimir Lenin, once said: "a lie told often enough becomes the truth." This campaign of Jewish deceit has steadily intensified over the years. When Jews sense an increase in awareness of their treachery and global crimes against humanity amongst the Gentile public (a natural reaction of which is resentment and hostility), the louder they begin to wail about their invented holocaust in the octopus of media organs they control. That's why they are always gauging the pulse of public opinion.

World leaders, Presidents, Prime Ministers, ceremonial Kings and Queens, Popes, Priests and Holy Men of all faiths, genuflect in groveling reverence of the mythical "6,000,000 Jews" who didn't perish in "Nazi gas chambers", as such chambers did not exist and were impossible. (See: VHO, IHR, CODOH, WSMOT, Zundelsite, Nazi Gassings Never Happened) Research shows that the reason for this bizarre Jewish fixation on the number 6,000,000 primarily stems from an ancient religious prophecy in the Torah. According to some sources, the prophecy envisioned that before the Jewish people could reclaim and reconquer Palestine to establish a Jewish homeland called "Israel", 6,000,000 Jews would first have to perish in a fiery burnt offering (i.e. "Holocaust"), as a sacrifice to their bloodthirsty tribal deity, YHWH. (See: Weintraub, Ben. The Holocaust Dogma of Judaism: Keystone of the New World Order. Washington, D.C.: Cosmo Pub., 1995.) Jewish author, Benjamen Blech, confirmed this reality in his book "The Secrets of Hebrew Words" (J Aronson Inc., 1991, p. 241), stating,

"You shall return minus 6,000,000"; Jewish scripture relates a prophecy that 6,000,000 Jews must vanish before they can reclaim Palestine as their ancient ancestral homeland.

    "The Hebrew word for 'ye shall return'(TaShuVU), seems to have been spelled incorrectly. Grammatically it requires another (vav). It ought to read (TaShUVU). Why is it lacking the letter (vav) which stands for six?. [TaShuVU] without the vav is a prediction to the Jewish people of ultimate return to their national homeland. TaShuVU in numbers adds up to 708: tav=400, shin=300, vei=2, vey=6. When we write the year, we ignore the millennia. In 1948 on the secular calendar, we witnessed the miracle of Jewish return to Israel. On the Hebrew calendar it was the year 5708. That was the year predicted by the incomplete word (TaShuVu), you shall return. We did return, lacking 6 – an all important 6 million of our people who perished in the holocaust. Yet the fulfillment of the prediction of return in precisely that year implied by the gematria of TaShuVU gives us firm hope that the words of the prophets for Final Redemption will come true as well."

Here are two additional commentaries on the origins of the "Six Million" from History & Scriptural Origins of the Six Million Number:

    [Quote 1] Jewish prophecies in the Torah require that 6 million Jews must "vanish" before the state of Israel can be formed. "You shall return minus 6 million." That's why Tom Segev, an Israeli historian, declared that the "6 million" is an attempt to transform the Holocaust story into state religion. Those six million, according to prophecy, had to disappear in "burning ovens", which the judicial version of the Holocaust now authenticates. As a matter of fact, Robert B. Goldmann writes: ". . . without the Holocaust, there would be no Jewish State." A simple consequence: Given six million Jews gassed at Auschwitz who ended up in the "burning ovens" (the Greek word holocaust means burned offerings), therefore, the prophecies have now been "fulfilled" and Israel can become a "legitimate state". –Unknown

    [Quote 2] Regarding the 'six million' number you should know the following: In the Hebrew text of the Torah prophesies, one can read "you shall return". In the text the letter "V" or "VAU" is absent, as Hebrew does not have any numbers; the letter V stands for the number 6. Ben Weintraub, a religious scientist, learned from rabbis that the meaning of the missing letter means the number is '6 million'. The prophesy then reads: You will return, but with 6 million less. See Ben Weintraub: "The Holocaust Dogma of Judaism", Cosmo Publishing, Washington 1995, page 3. The missing 6 million must be so before the Jews can return to the Promised Land. Jahweh sees this as a cleaning of the souls of the sinful people. The Jews must, on the return to the Promised Land, be clean — the cleaning shall be done in burning stokes. — A Correspondent

Is it just coincidental that the flimsy and farcical story of "6,000,000 Jews" being murdered in "gas chambers" and burned up in "ovens" in concentration camps during WWII gave the Jews the impetus and PR ammunition they needed to make their "gallant return" to the "promised land" at the war's end — occupying and ethnically cleansing much of Palestine through terrorism and force of arms — establishing a racist/apartheid "Jewish state" called "Israel" in 1948? And this all just happens to fit the previously cited ancient Torah prophecy to the letter? I hardly think so!"

This is what convinced me that this is all a pack-of-lies that has justified the destruction and take-over of our world as we see it.

Lindsey

[LordLindsey]

Revisionism is a joke, but it's not a funny one, it's sad and pathetic, and it hurts a lot of people that I don't wish you to ever be one of them.

-Jan

Please elaborate on my Bold emphasis of your quote.  I am not quite sure how you intend the word "hurt".

Are you familiar with David Irving-Author & Historian?

It appears to me that he is referring to PEOPLE WHO ARE PUT INTO PRISON FOR THREE TO FIVE YEARS FOR QUESTIONING AN EVENT THAT HAS BEEN PROVEN TO NOT HAVE OCCURRED AS HAS BEEN DESCRIBED.  It sounds to me like something of a THREAT that if you question that "MAGICAL-NUMBER" then you will go to prison, and this "angel" doesn't want to see that happen to your or anyone who lives in a nation that has STUPIDLY allowed the ADL-controlled politicians to commit treason against their people by passing laws criminalizing THOUGHTS and SPEECH THAT REFUTES "ACCEPTED" EVENTS IN HISTORY.

It is apparent that Jan really enjoys the fact that Germany has been completely enslaved to the point where it is a CRIME to merely QUESTION what actually happened, but I can assure you that PRIVATELY most Germans who have found a way to find this information--mainly after having left Germany and somehow found this information from others in nations like America and elsewhere--are never the same about the lies that have been told about their nation.

Lindsey

NB:  I have seen it with my own eyes with a young German co-worker who knew NOTHING about any of this stuff, but was a left-wing activist.  After I educated him on just A LITTLE of what we all know in the REAL truth-movement, he was never the same and wanted to know as much as he possibly could find before he went back to his occupied nation.

[LordLindsey]

THIS is what ABSOLUTELY PROVED TO ME that the "MAGICAL-NUMBER" is a GOD DAMNED LIE.

Lindsey

http://servv89pn0aj.sn.sourcedns.com/~g ... ndex1.html

"1918-
"Six million souls" need a billion dollars

The British take control of Palestine, and occupy the country militarily. Eventually the British Mandate for Palestine is administered, against the will of the Arabs living there.

This same year Jewish Communist leader Grigory Zinoviev announces plans for the annihilation of 10,000,000 Russians.

Jewish Communists plot genocide of Russians. They put out stories of Jewish persecution at this same time to hide their blood-curdling atrocities in Russia.

1919-
Shortly after the end of World War I hostilities, Zionists claim a "Holocaust" of "Six Million Jews" is imminent in Europe in a deceitful campaign to raise money for Jewish charities and also to distract public attention from the Jewish origins of Communism, the Bolshevik atrocities in Russia and the Armenian Genocide.

The first reported "Holocaust" of "Six Million Jews." Nothing more than Zionist propaganda.

Elder of Zion Nathan Straus published this article in the San Fransico Chronicle claiming 6,000,000 Jews were in peril.

More persecution propaganda in the same year. Again "6,000,000 Jews" as victims, of course.

Full article of above clipping

1920-
A Jewish relief campaign advertisement states: "Today 6,000,000 Jews are facing the darkest days ever known in the history of the race."

1921-
Russian patriots gain ground on the Jewish Bolshevik usurpers of their nation. In a vein attempt to hide their heavy involvement in the brutal Bolshevist atrocities being committed in Russia, Jews reel out the "six million" myth once again.

1922-
Zionist leader, Nahum Sokolow, boasts about Organized Jewry's globalist ambitions when, at a Zionist conference in Carlsbad, California, he proclaimed: "The League of Nations is a Jewish idea, and Jerusalem some day will become the capital of the world's peace."

1931-

Six Million again. Jews demand that Gentiles hand over their food to the poor, innocent Jews while they murder millions, and ship millions more off to Gulag slave camps in Communist Jew-controlled Russia.

1932-
Jews commit a deliberate genocide. To put down nationalist resistance to a Communist takeover, Soviet Dictator Josef Stalin orders the Jewish-dominated Soviet Secret Police (NKVD) to orchestrate a man-made famine in the Ukraine. Stalin's Jewish deputies and secret police chiefs (Kaganovich, Beria, Yagoda, etc) ruthlessly implement the murderous starvation policy. Between six and seven million Ukrainian men, women and children, are annihilated in this genuine Holocaust. It is now known as the "Holodomor."

1933-

Adolf Hitler becomes Chancellor of Germany in 1933. Jews immediately seek his complete destruction.

Hitler comes to power in Germany. Antithetical to Jewish banking interests which thrives off of usury (the lending of money at interest making debt-slaves out of countries), Hitler immediately begins printing his own state-controlled, labor-backed currency and thus breaking the death-grip of the monolithic Jewish banking establishment of Europe, led by the Rothschild's and the Warburg's. Hitler also removed Jews from all positions in government, media, education and banks, which they had been dominating up until that point.

Because of this World Jewry declares war on Germany in 1933. Jews around the world launched a global economic boycott of German goods in an effort to economically strangle Germany to death and topple Hitler's new government.

Jews don't like it when Gentiles revolt against their tyranny and control. Their motto is: be our slave or be dead.

This act of treachery leads to widespread dislike of Jews in Germany and foments tension between Jews and German Gentiles. For this act, and for the Jews' well-known support for Communism and substantial involvement in the bloody Bolshevik Revolution, the Nazis declare Jews "enemies of the state" eventually interning them in concentration camps and labor camps during the Second World War. Almost the same thing happened to Japanese-Americans after Pearl Harbor. Although, unlike the Jews, Japanese people never waged an economic war on America, they were interned in American concentration camps simply for their ethnicity.

1936-
As early as 1936, Zionists who originally coined the phrase Final Solution of The Jewish Question, somehow knew exactly 6,000,000 Jews had "neither hope nor future."

Appearing before the Peel Commission, World Zionist Organization chairman, and first Israeli president, Chaim Weizmann, declares that "6,000,000 Jews are destined to be imprisoned," (in Europe) "where they are unwanted."

Jews continue to agitate for Palestine. The New York Times reported that Zionist groups were desperately lobbying American Christian leaders, Christian organizations, and the British government, demanding assistance in the creation of a "Jewish nation in Palestine" to save the Jews from "the European Holocaust." These strikingly prophetic statements were made years before the creation of ghettos or concentration camps and over three years before the German invasion of Poland.

Jewish leaders meet to discuss their schemes, swindles and sinister conspiracies. "Six Million Hebrews" is mentioned in the article title.

1938-

Jew propagandists amp up the "Six Million" b.s. as World War II draws closer.

This article references "five or six million Jews uprooted by dictatorships" and calls for them to be settled in the "Holy Land" (Palestine)."

http://servv89pn0aj.sn.sourcedns.com/~g ... lion-myth/

[LordLindsey]

This is a copy of Jurgen Graf's book, "The Giant with Feet of Clay," where he completely destroys the 'holocaust' pope Raul Hilberg and shows how faulty his works are:

http://vho.org/dl/ENG/Giant.pdf

Lindsey

[Timothy_Fitzpatrick]

Lindsey, do you realize you are promoting a website (winston smith) that calls your hero ZCF a plagiarist?

[jan]

Answer to Lindsey,

First you should know that there's an extensive work criticizing the denial of gas chambers, people who are far more experts to this than me. Read this:

There have been claims by Holocaust deniers that the gas chambers which mainstream historians believe were for the massacre of civilians never existed, but rather that the structures identified as gas chambers actually served other purposes. These other purposes include delousing and disinfection. A similar argument is sometimes used that claims gas was not used to murder Jews and other victims, and that many gas chambers were also built after the war just for show. A document advancing this theory is the Leuchter report by Fred A. Leuchter, a paper stating that only traces of cyanide were found when he examined samples taken from one of the Auschwitz gas chambers in 1988. This is often cited as evidence that gas was not used in the chambers, as no trace amounts remain. Despite the difficulty of finding traces of this material 50 years later, in February, 1990, Professor Jan Markiewicz, Director of the Institute of Forensic Research in Kraków, redid the analysis.[32] Markiewicz and his team used microdiffusion techniques to test for cyanide in samples from the suspected gas chambers, from delousing chambers, and from control areas elsewhere within Auschwitz. The control samples tested negative, while cyanide residue was found in high concentrations in the delousing chambers, and lower concentrations in the homicidal gas chambers. This is consistent with the amounts required to kill lice and humans.[33]
The search for cyanide in the bricks of buildings said to be gas chambers was important, because the pesticide Zyklon B would generate such a residue. This was the gas most often cited as the instrument of death for prisoners in the gas chambers, supported by both testimony and evidence collected of Nazi policy.
Another claim made by Holocaust deniers is that there were no vents in the gas chambers through which Zyklon B could be inserted.[34] The BBC offers a response showing that this requires disregard of much documentation:
Deniers have said for years that physical evidence is lacking because they have seen no holes in the roof of the Birkenau gas chamber where the Zyklon was poured in. (In some of the gas chambers the Zyklon B was poured in through the roof, while in others it was thrown in through the windows.) The roof was dynamited at war's end, and today lies broken in pieces, but three of the four original holes were positively identified in a recent paper. Their location in the concrete matches with eyewitness testimony, aerial photos from 1944, and a ground photo from 1943. The physical evidence shows unmistakably that the Zyklon holes were cast into the concrete when the building was constructed.[35]
Leuchter's comment that the camp was "untouched" is dismissed as nonsense by Holocaust scholar Robert Jan van Pelt, who explains that the absence of most of the would-be rubble from the crematoria is because the local Polish population returning to the area after the war rebuilt farmhouses to the west with bricks salvaged from rubble in the camp area including from the Birkenau crematoria.[36] Near those crematoria is a pile of broken bricks thrown aside in the search for usable intact bricks.
Another piece of evidence Holocaust deniers frequently question is what happened to the ash after the bodies were cremated. The amount of ash produced in the cremation of a person is about a shoebox full, if done in a proper crematorium. However, eyewitness testimonies documented by Hilberg's The Destruction of the European Jews describe the burning process used in Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec to have carried out in multiple open-air grills where stacks of bodies were burned on top of metal bars. These grills were operated by burning piles of wood underneath. It has been questioned by Holocaust deniers[37] if it would have been possible to burn hundreds of thousands of corpses using the method as documented by Hilberg, especially when the low efficiency of such burning process, the high amounts of wood required and the often windy weather conditions of the camps are taken into account.
Cremation in the open at the Reinhard death camps (Treblinka, Sobibor and Belzec) was discussed at Nuremberg on the 7th April 1946 by Georg Konrad Morgen, SS judge and lawyer who investigated crimes committed in Nazi concentration camps. He stated: "The whole thing was like an assembly line. At the last stop they reached a big room, and were told that this was the bath. When the last one was in, the doors were shut and the gas was let into the room. As soon as death taken place in (sic), the ventilators were started. When the air was breathable, the doors were opened, and the Jewish workers removed the bodies. By means of a special process which Wirth had invented, they were burned in the open air without the use of fuel." [38]
Aerial photographs of Auschwitz indicate that what appears to be ash produced in Auschwitz was piled into the nearby river and marsh, and there is well-documented evidence that other ash was used as fertilizer in nearby fields. Photographs of Treblinka taken by the camp commandant show what looks to be ash piles being distributed by steam shovels.[citation needed]
Another argument used by Holocaust deniers is that testimony on the gas chambers is unreliable. The Institute for Historical Review is one of the organizations which make this assertion. In the words of the IHR:
"Hoss [Hoess] said in his confession that his men would smoke cigarettes as they pulled the dead Jews out of the gas chambers ten minutes after gassing. Isn't Zyklon-B explosive? Highly so. The Hoss confession is obviously false."
The Nizkor Project and other sources have pointed out that the minimal concentration of Zyklon-B to be explosive is 56,000 parts per million, while the amount used to kill a human is 300 parts per million, as is evidenced in "The Merck Index" and the "CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics". In fact, the Nazi's own documentation stated "Danger of explosion: 75 grams of HCN in 1 cubic meter of air. Normal application approx. 8-10 grams per cubic meter, therefore not explosive." (Nuremberg document NI-9912)
The Institute for Historical Review publicly offered a reward of $50,000 for verifiable "proof that gas chambers for the purpose of killing human beings existed at or in Auschwitz." Mel Mermelstein, a survivor of Auschwitz, submitted his own testimony as proof but it was ignored. He then sued IHR in the United States and the case was subsequently settled for $50,000, plus $40,000 in damages for personal suffering. The court declared the statement that "that Jews were gassed to death at the Auschwitz Concentration Camp in Poland during the summer of 1944" was a fact.[39]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_ ... ust_denial

Your first link: http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... nated.html

This is a collection of false testimonies in the Zündel 1985 trial. The court dismissed this testimonies and the denier lost the trial.
"Raul Hilberg's expert witness testimony at the first Zundel trial in 1985" - read the article, Hilberg confirms the systematic extermination of miliions of Jews, he did this also in dozens of books and articles with extensive research (see bibliography here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raul_Hilberg)
William Lindsey's expert witness testimony - he presented no scientific proof that the Gas Chambers didn't exist. He repeats against this ridiculous argument with the doors of the gas chambers, ignoring the fact that the Soviets removed the original doors.

This document does not present a single evidence that there were no gas chambers, and does not refer to any of the documents and testimonies of hundreds of real experts suggesting that there were.
Here's a good review of extermination by gas in Auschwitz with specific details and sources: http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... mbers.html

Second link: http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... 6d081f0459

Professor Arno J. Mayer, Why Did the Heavens Not Darken: He did not refute the existence of the gas chambers, only called for more rigorous studies and said that they are needed. This is what scientists do, he definitely wouldn't share your disgusting denial of the extermination.
The quotes in your link are distorted. You can find a review on the distortion on his wiki page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arno_J._Ma ... _Darken.3F

About Robert Jan van Pelt (the guy that helps bringing David Irving down, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Jan_van_Pelt) - what a stupid manipulation is done there on what he said - he of course answered a question about the important of the site and said that are knowledge is not dependent on the preservation of physical evidences. He wasn't even talking particularly about the holocaust in that sentence, it was a general remark. Wow, one has to be incredibly stupid to think that he meant that we have no proof....

Christopher Browning - I see no problem with what he said, indeed the Germans did a good job in destroying a lot of evidences, and the case is strong enough despite that.

The judge in Irving vs. Lipstadt trial - why don't you take a look at the link provided there, the judge accepted the evidences presented by the defense: http://www.hdot.org/en/trial/judgement/06.15

I'm a bit surprised by the way Finkelstein is presented there, "Jewish scholar, whose father
survived Auschwitz, and whose mother survived Majdanek" - "survived Auschwitz" what is there to "survive" exactly? I thought it's all a hoax.
That's actually the real issue here- you don't really believe that the holocaust didn't happen, you know it did. And you probably support it and glad that it took place. The thing that really bothers you is that the world sympathizes with the Jews today, and you can't stand that. You're motivations are pure hate and bigotry.

I'm not going to continue since I don't have time now. One thing should be emphasized- stronger evidences for the Gas Chambers we know about today came AFTER the period all your "quotes" come from. For example, in 2008 the Nazi blueprints of Auschwitz revealed the plan for the gas chambers: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/no ... -world-war

About the number 6 million - just because the number appeared in different contexts before, that doesn't mean that there wasn't a holocaust. This is perhaps the most ridiculous argument.

And no, it's not a coincidence that the holocaust happened at the same time that the Jews tried to save themselves and establish their own state on a tiny piece of land in the Middle East - both are the result of hundreds of years of persecution and demonization, from the type that people like you continue vomiting even today. And the Jews should be happy and proud they have their own state today, so whenever they see the filth spread against them by people like you, they can do the opposite of what I'm doing now and say "who gives a fuck?" and continue living their lives, developing and advancing the world, inventing new technologies, promoting health, education, science, and everything that Jews do way better than anyone else. So you keep on spreading hate online, and they keep on living their lives, and also making sure your children will live longer and happier in a better world. And they wouldn't give a damn about what you think of them!

[LordLindsey]

"...both are the result of hundreds of years of persecution and demonization, from the type that people like you continue vomiting even today. And the Jews should be happy and proud they have their own state today, so whenever they see the filth spread against them by people like you, they can do the opposite of what I'm doing now and say "who gives a fuck?" and continue living their lives, developing and advancing the world, inventing new technologies, promoting health, education, science, and everything that Jews do way better than anyone else."

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am so glad that you said this, and I am saving it here just so that EVERYONE can see what you TRULY believe about those telling the truths as they are, and what you TRULY BELIEVE about your "people."

God, I simply could not have asked for anything better than this!!!  I sincerely thank you, "Jan," for getting so upset that you showed your true-colors.  

Lindsey

[Wimpy]

So you keep on spreading hate online, and they keep on living their lives, and also making sure your children will live longer and happier in a better world. And they wouldn't give a damn about what you think of them!

-Jan

We did not have to wait long for the old "spreading hate" canard, did we now?  

Jan, your intolerance of people seeking and knowing the truth, including your thinly disguised threats against me and the "your" children blah-blah, has me convinced that you do not belong on this website.  How's that for intolerance?

[LordLindsey]

"Jan," what I really want to see if your refutation of ZCF's master-piece, "The jew World Order Unmasked."  When you are ready, please post it to this Topic so that we can all see how you explain-away the FACTS AS THEY REALLY OCCURRED IN THE PERIOD OF RUSSIAN-HISTORY AFTER THE jews TOOK-OVER THAT NATION FROM THE CZAR!

Man, I can not WAIT to see this.

Lindsey

[jan]

I'll post it when I'm done, better after the debate tomorrow (which I hope will be on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and not about your imaginary "Jewish domination" or whatever...).

Whimpy, you're seriously suggesting that I threaten you or something? Where did you get it from? unlike you and everyone else here, I'm not cursing anyone (and you didn't write me even one sentence that is not about cursing me, or at least thinking that your cursing me - calling me Jewish or with Jewish-related slurs is not an insult to me, on the contrary).

You should however know that the majority of the world, including me, is disgusted by your hate and bigotry. It's your right to spread hate, I don't wish to take this right away from you, and I wish to hear more about your hate, but did I ever suggest that I would agree with this nonsense? I'm not manipulated so easily, and a collection of fake and distorted quotes wouldn't make me a bigot.

[Wimpy]

LordLindsey,

Why the hate, you hater?  Jan is from that polite and ultra-ethnocentric Ashkenazi Tribe, whom are plainly smarter than all the Goyim in the World now and forever, and he is ever so sincere with his concern for all goyim.  Please stop the persecution of this loving, giving, nurturing, kind,  honest and generous people.      :lol:

[Wimpy]

Whimpy, you're seriously suggesting that I threaten you or something? Where did you get it from? unlike you and everyone else here, I'm not cursing anyone (and you didn't write me even one sentence that is not about cursing me, or at least thinking that your cursing me - calling me Jewish or with Jewish-related slurs is not an insult to me, on the contrary).

Liar, show me where I cursed.  And, yes, you did threaten me.  I am a Catholic and you can call me one.  You are a Jew and I can not call you one?  How twisted is that? 0:)  

You should however know that the majority of the world, including me, is disgusted by your hate and bigotry. It's your right to spread hate, I don't wish to take this right away from you, and I wish to hear more about your hate, but did I ever suggest that I would agree with this nonsense? I'm not manipulated so easily, and a collection of fake and distorted quotes wouldn't make me a bigot.

Oh, no!  I'm a hater now?  Just like LordLindsey.......oh, man..how terribly dreadful.  Please love me and forgive my transgressions against your Tribe. :roll:

[jan]

the funniest thing with you is that you're saying horrible things about Jews, demonizing every aspect of their lives, but then you are insulted when someone tells you that Jews are better than you or if you find a quote of a Jew from 100 years ago saying he doesn't particularly like Goyim...

Oh, and I didn't say Jews are smarter than others, I said that they are better.

[LordLindsey]

Keep talking, "Jan," because you are doing all of the work proving our points so that we do not have to do anything else to prove what we have been saying this entire time!  Man, you just do not see how EVERYONE ELSE IS SEEING YOU, do you?

Anyway, I really want to know what everyone here at TIU thinks of this, because I am actually SHOCKED that "Jan" would come-out and say these things, and even after all of the information has been given, would STILL say that we are "haters" and "demonizers" and "liars."

"Jan," TELLING THE TRUTH ABOUT WHO IS DOING WHAT TO THE HUMAN-RACE AND OUR PLANET IN-GENERAL MAY BE CONSIDERED "HATE-SPEECH" BY THE DEMONS WALKING-ON-TWO-LEGS WHO ARE DOING THIS SHIT TO US AND OUR PLANET, BUT TO EVERY OTHER NORMAL AND RATIONAL HUMAN-BEING WHO IS BEING FORCED TO SUFFER THIS FUCKING INSANE TORTURE THAT WE CAN SEE WITH OUR OWN TWO EYES, THIS IS SIMPLY STANDING-UP AND BEING A MAN AND TELLING THE FUCKING TRUTH AS IT IS, NOT AS WE WANT IT TO BE.

You can NOT, and will NEVER be able to, defend the in-defensible, and this goes FAR BEYOND simply what israHell HAS DONE, and IS CURRENTLY DOING, to the Palestinians on THEIR LAND; this whole thing is about what our future as a HUMAN-RACE will be like if "THE jewish-UTOPIA" becomes a reality, as outlined in The Protocols and elsewhere, INCLUDING jewish SCHOLARS' OWN WORKS.

Lindsey

NB:  The reason that you and your "people" have gotten away with being able to scream "HATE-SPEECH!!!!  HATER!!!!  DEMONIZER!!!!" each and every fucking time that FACTS AS THEY ARE AND TRUTHS AS THEY HAVE BEEN DISCOVERED TO BE are brought-out is because of the NEARLY ABSOLUTE CONTROL OF THE MEDIA AND GOVERNMENTS/COURTS BY THE SAME PEOPLE WHO SAID WHAT THEY WERE GOING TO DO CENTURIES AGO, AND ARE NOW DOING IT, and believe me when I tell you that the average human-being is FINALLY starting to realize that not only is something terribly, terribly wrong with our planet, but they are SLOWLY BUT SURELY starting to put it all together, thanks to the efforts of people like Charles Giuliani, Daryl Bradford Smith, Deanna Spingola, and many of the people on this forum and other forums, who are sick and tired of watching our planet be destroyed, our nations taken-over from within, and our society and morality collapsed so that psychopaths/sociopaths who believe that they are "GOD-INCARNATE," or "gods walking-on-Earth," can make the people stupid enough to accept their enslavement and/or destruction, and are screaming-from-the-roof-tops ABOUT WHAT IS HAPPENING, WHO IS DOING THIS TO US, AND THAT WE ARE NEVER, EVER GOING TO FUCKING ACCEPT THIS!!!

[jan]

Lindsey,

Exclamation marks and capital letters don't make any impression on me. I would also suggest relaxing a bit, drinking water or something.. it seems you're really pissed off man! Not so healthy, then you'll get a heart attack or something, and god forbids, one of the demons walking-on-two-legs that actually did something in his life will have to take care of you in a hospital. You wouldn't want that to happen would you (the Jewish doctor thing I mean, not the heart attack...)?

[Wimpy]

the funniest thing with you is that you're saying horrible things about Jews, demonizing every aspect of their lives, but then you are insulted when someone tells you that Jews are better than you or if you find a quote of a Jew from 100 years ago saying he doesn't particularly like Goyim...

Oh, and I didn't say Jews are smarter than others, I said that they are better.

Horrible things.  What things?  

You must be thinking about something else when referring to a quote from 100 years ago.  Quite frankly, this animosity towards Goyim is quite contemporary.  You would be a liar to deny that the Laws of Moses only pertain to Man. Further, Goyim are not Men according to the World Synagogue/Talmudic teachings; Therefore the Laws of Moses do not apply to Goyim.  Sound familiar?

So where does that leave the Goyim in the scheme of Jewry?  Can you steal from, lie to, covet Shiksa or Goy Toys, or murder a Goyim without violating Moses Laws.  Why yes, you can.  Just don't do it to a fellow tribesman.  Simple, no?