Dutch force referendum over loss of sovereignty to Brussels

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Thierry Baudet, who delivered the petition with Jan Roos, wants to turn the vote into a plebiscite on the Netherlands' membership of the EU
Jaap Arriens/ NurPhoto/Corbis
Dutch force referendum over loss of sovereignty to Brussels Times
Bruno Waterfield Brussels
Published at 12:01AM, September 28 2015
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/world/europe/article4569276.ece
http://crashrecovery.org/daily/28.09.2015/Dutch-force-referendum-over-loss-of-sovereignty-to-Brussels.html

  "Dutch voters are on course for a European Union referendum in the
   spring after a petition attracted enough signatures to trigger a
   plebiscite on further enlargement into eastern Europe.
     The Dutch will almost certainly hold a vote on an EU "association"
   treaty with Ukraine in April.
     Last night, Eurosceptic campaigners succeeded in collecting the 300,000
   signatures required to force a vote on the impact of EU enlargement and
   mass migration from eastern Europe.
     Thierry Baudet, an author and academic who launched the Forum for
   Democracy to campaign for a referendum, aims to turn the vote into a
   plebiscite on Dutch EU memberchip.
     "It can be a decisive step," he said. "We will put the question of
   the EU on the agenda with a broad focus on all aspects of the EU."
     Campaigners launched the petition to mark the tenth anniversary of
   the Dutch vote rejecting the the EU constitution in June 2005. That
   vote was ignored, with no repeat referendum for the almost identical
   Lisbon Treaty four years later, a decision that has caused resentment.
     Polling this month suggested that 83 per cent of voters wanted "more
   influence" over any future transfers of sovereignty to Brussels, and
   61 per cent demanded a referendum on enlargement of the EU.
     Under Dutch law, a referendum can be held if 300,000 signatures are
   collected withing six weeks.
   Euroskeptic campaigners used a parliamentary vote last month on legis-
   lation enshrining an EU "association" trade and aid treaty with Ukraine
   as the trigger to begin collecting signatures.
     Free movement and EU open borders rules have allowed mass migration
   from eastern Europe to the Netherlands, leading to calls for restrictions
   on benefit claims and job seeking.
     Mr Baudet said that the Ukraine association treaty, a first step to
   visa-free travel and EU membership with free movement rights for Ukrainians,
   had deepened the Dutch public's concerns over open borders.
     "The open borders issue is very big, like the euro people only seem
   to learn from catastrophes," he said. "Open borders are untenable. The
   public sees that and our maximum capacity has been reached. It can't
   go on for much longer. The idea that we can surrender such an essential
   feature of sovereignty such as the defence of our border to this
   impersonal organisation has gone."
     Nigel Farage, the leader of Ukip, said: "This will have a huge impact
   on the British debate."
     For the EU association treaty with Ukraine to enter into force on January
   1, all countries must ratify it. At best, the Dutch referendum will lead
   to a delay, and at worst a No vote would sink the treaty.
     One EU diplomat said: "If the Dutch vote No, it will be another
   nightmare."

September 28, 2015 9:02 am
Netherlands faces possible referendum on Ukraine  FT.com
Alex Barker in Brussels
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d2d9aab8-65a8-11e5-a28b-50226830d644.html#axzz3nBv79AZW
http://crashrecovery.org/daily/28.09.2015/Netherlands-faces-possible-referendum-on-Ukraine.html

"The Netherlands is heading towards a contentious European referendum
   after an activist website collected enough signatures to trigger a
   non-binding plebiscite on the EU's landmark integration pact with
   Ukraine.
   
   While it is unclear what effect, if any, the vote will have on Dutch
   government policy, the process further complicates EU policy on
   Ukraine, casting doubt over a flagship EU deal that outraged Moscow and
   became one of the underlying causes of a war which has raged since 2014.
   
   The approximately 450,000 signatures amassed by GeenStijl, a satirical
   news website, far exceeds the 300,000 needed under law to trigger a
   referendum. It poses a vexing political problem for the largely pro-EU
   Dutch government, which has already ratified the Ukraine pact.
   
   The website said it was the first to bring a successful application to
   the electoral council, putting Holland on course to a "historic
   referendum". "You did it, out of love for democracy in the Netherlands
   and Europe, and to send a signal to The Hague and Brussels," the
   website told readers on Sunday.
   
   Once signatures are verified by authorities, a referendum must be held
   within six months. It is unclear what effect if any it would have on
   the entry into force of a free-trade pact with Ukraine, which in spite
   of complaints from Russia is scheduled for the beginning of 2016.
   
   Under Dutch law the referendum triggered would only be "advisory" in
   nature for the government. In the event of a turnout of more than 30
   per cent and a majority voting against the deal, the Dutch government
   is obliged to revisit its legislation ratifying the Ukraine accord.
   
   While welcoming the exercise in direct democracy, mainstream Dutch
   parties including the Labour party, which is in the ruling coalition,
   all reiterated their support for the Ukraine accord, showing it may be
   hard to force a policy U-turn.
   
   Even so EU officials are worried the referendum could have
   unpredictable political results if the vote is impossible to ignore.
   
   This could either delay implementation of a trade deal — handing a
   diplomatic victory to Russia — or upend the whole accord — which
   requires EU unanimity to be ratified — in the event of a decisive No
   vote.
   
   The website opted to target the Ukraine agreement because it was
   eligible under Dutch law. It also touches on issues around the economic
   expansion of the EU — including through potential visa liberalisation
   and pledges of aid — to a country torn apart in a conflict with
   Russian-backed separatists.
   
   The EU's association agreement with Ukraine effectively makes it a
   member of the EU single market, in return for adopting EU regulations
   and standards. It requires reforms to improve transparency and rule of
   law, while offering potential benefits such as visa liberalisation and
   financial support for reform.
   
   The Dutch campaigners launched the referendum push in part to mark the
   10th anniversary of the Dutch vote rejecting the EU constitution in
   June 2005.
   Related Topics
   
       European Union
   
  Copyright The Financial Times Limited 2015. You may share using our
   article tools.
   Please don't cut articles from FT.com and redistribute by email or post
   to the web. "

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[MikeWB]

Whatever the results are of that plebiscite, we can be sure that it will be ignored. EU elites don't care what people think and since this is non-binding, they'll just ignore it.

Speaking of Netherlands, I have a friend who works in Rotterdam and he tells me that he's moving back to US because Rotterdam is so bad that he fears his kids will be attacked/raped/murdered. He says there are gangs of immigrants there who basically rule the city during night.

[rmstock]

WORLD
The Netherlands to Hold Referendum on EU Trade Deal With Ukraine
Euroskeptic campaigners could force Dutch government to reconsider Association Agreement
By MAARTEN VAN TARTWIJK 
Oct. 14, 2015 5:47 a.m. ET
http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-netherlands-to-hold-referendum-on-eu-trade-deal-with-ukraine-1444816023

  "AMSTERDAM—The Netherlands will hold a referendum next year on a
   landmark European Union trade deal with Ukraine after pressure from
   euroskeptic campaigners.

   The Dutch Electoral Council on Wednesday said campaigners had amassed
   more than 400,000 valid signatures, above the minimum of 300,000 needed
   to launch a referendum. The vote, which will be the first to take place
   under a new referendum law that came into force earlier this year ,
   will take place within six months. The referendum question has yet to
   be decided.

   The referendum requires a minimum turnout of 30% to be valid but isn't
   binding. However, it would oblige the Dutch government to reconsider
   the so-called Association Agreement between the EU and Ukraine, which
   the Netherlands has already ratified.

   It is unclear how the vote will affect the trade pact, which has been
   at the heart of EU policy toward Kiev and is fiercely opposed by Russia.
   
   A senior EU official said the treaty would come into full effect on
   Jan. 1 as planned despite the Dutch referendum under a so-called
   temporary application. Only if the Ukraine agreement is rejected by
   Dutch voters would EU governments then have to discuss with Ukraine how
   to respond.
   
   Campaigners who called for the referendum, including news website
   GeenStijl, say the vote will enable Dutch voters to have a bigger say
   in European affairs. "The Association Treaty with Ukraine, which has
   led to deteriorating relations between the West and Russia, is only an
   instrument to address a wider problem: the democratic deficit of the
   European Union," campaigners said on their website.
   
   Write to Maarten van Tartwijk at maarten.vantartwijk@wsj.com "

[rmstock]

Home >News >Politics >BETRAYED: EU sticks two fingers up at Dutch voters and opens door to 45 MILLION Ukrainians
BETRAYED: EU sticks two fingers up at Dutch voters and opens door to 45 MILLION Ukrainians
EUROPE'S elite tonight dropped all pretence of respecting democracy by plotting to grant visa-free travel to 45 million Ukrainians in direct defiance of the Dutch referendum result.
By Nick Gutteridge
PUBLISHED: 00:00, Mon, Apr 11, 2016 | UPDATED: 11:08, Mon, Apr 11, 2016
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/659825/Dutch-referendum-EU-Brussels-Ukraine-deal-visa-free-travel-Rutte-Brexit


The Dutch people are set to be betrayed by the EU and their own Government

  "Brussels bureaucrats have strongly indicated they will simply ride
   roughshod over the voice of an entire nation in their grasping bid to
   secure further power in Eastern Europe. 
   
   Two-thirds of the Dutch people rejected a controversial EU land grab
   plot in a landmark referendum last week, which only took place because
   of a people's revolt against the European elite.
   
   
   Related articles
   
      'Leave now' Dutch urge Britons to back Brexit amid despotic EU plot...
   
       Brussels insists land grab plot WILL go ahead despite Dutch 'no'
   
   
   But tonight it emerged that they have been betrayed by both their own
   Government and mandarins in Brussels, who are ploughing on with the
   Ukraine deal regardless.
   
   The despotic move will further fuel claims that the EU has no respect
   for democracy, and comes just weeks before Britons decide on whether or
   not to quit the 28-nation bloc.
   
   
   Mr Rutte will back visa-free travel for Ukrainians against the wishes of his voters
   
   
   The announcement comes just four days after the Dutch people overwhelmingly rejected the deal
   
   Dutch campaigners had previously warned that the British people should
   opt for a Brexit if their democratic wishes were ignored, saying it
   would show the Brussels regime has become so corrupt all hopes of
   reform are lost.
   
   On an historic night last Thursday an overwhelming 61.1% of Dutch
   voters rejected the Ukraine land grab plot, which aims to bring Kiev
   into the EU's sphere of influence.
   
   The prospect of 45 million Ukrainians being granted visa-free access to
   the Schengen free movement zone - of which the Netherlands is a part -
   was one of the key reasons voters blocked the deal.
   
   But just days later the dictatorial EU Commission has indicated it will
   stick two fingers up to the country's 17 million people and implement
   the travel arrangements regardless.
   
   
   The EU Commission has decided expanding its regime is more important than democracy
   
   
   The decision will make David Cameron's fight to keep Britain in the EU even harder
   
   A senior EU source said: "It may look as if we're ignoring the Dutch
   voters, but we have to keep our word to Ukraine, which has met the
   conditions."
   
   The confirmation comes after European leaders including Angela Merkel
   and Francois Hollande indicated within hours of the Dutch result being
   announced that Brussels was likely to simply ignore it.
   
   Astonishingly, even the Dutch Government has betrayed its own people to
   kow-tow to the EU regime.
   
   Yesterday Prime Minister Mark Rutte told Ukrainian leader Petro
   Poroshenko that he will champion the "granting of a visa free travel
   regime" against the overwhelming wishes of his people.
   
   

       What the f***?
       Dutch referendum campaigner Thierry Baudet
   
   The conversation, reported by the Interfax news agency, is an
   astonishing volte face from a politician who just four days ago said
   crushing defeat in the referendum meant the EU treaty now "cannot go
   ahead".
   
   And even if the Dutch Government does choose to represent its people
   when the proposal is put forward it will be unable to block it, as it
   only needs to be passed by a qualified majority of EU member states and
   by MEPs in the European Parliament to take effect.
   
   As a result, the entire population of war-torn Ukraine is set to gain
   the right to travel throughout mainland Europe by as early as next
   month.
   
   Thierry Baudet, one of the activists who collected 400,000 signatures
   to secure last week's referendum, reacted to the revelations on Twitter
   by simply asking: "What the f***?"
   
   He later added: "Mark, no is no. The treaty must be shelved."
   
   Before the referendum result Mr Baudet, who is the founding director of
   the Forum for Democracy, said British voters would be watching to see
   if the EU decided to honour the result.
   
   He said: "If politicians ignore the Dutch 'no' then it will be an even
   stronger signal than what the British have already received - that
   there is no way to correct the European political class and that they
   should vote to leave."
   
   Ukraine is not the only country impatiently awaiting visa-free travel
   to be granted by ever-expansionist Brussels.
   
   EU leaders have promised to speed up visa liberalisation for Turkey,
   aiming for agreement by late June if Ankara meets the many conditions.
   If that goes ahead, 80 million Turks will have access to the whole of
   the Schengen zone.
   
   The Commission is also working on a politically sensitive proposal to
   extend the scheme to Kosovo, which has a population of around two
   million.
     
  Related articles
    Dutch voters head to the polls in historic vote on EU project
   'The beginning of the END for the EU' Brexit fans rejoice
   EU chief drops HUGE gaffe which shows why we need a Brexit  "