Off Tangent Show 12 with your host Latin

[LatinAmericanview]

What is the current political situation? If we did once live under constitutional rule then today we do not. This is just an observation, Do the the old safe guards of the the constitution apply in our modern society? No! The list of constitutional violations are lengthy and impressive. So this begs the question what type of rule do we live under?  I believe that we are currently in the beginning stages of Caerarism.

here is a short preview of an essay fro the Military perspective.

CHARLES J. DUNLAP, JR.
From Parameters, Winter 1992-93, pp. 2-20.


The letter that follows takes us on a darkly imagined excursion into the future. A military coup has taken place in the United States–the year is 2012–and General Thomas E. T. Brutus, Commander-in-Chief of the Unified Armed Forces of the United States (reference to Caesar), now occupies the White House as permanent Military Plenipotentiary. His position has been ratified by a national referendum, though scattered disorders still prevail and arrests for acts of sedition are underway.  http://latinamericanview.wordpress.com/ ... p-of-2012/


Topics covered
Post Constitutional Rule
Caesar
Leo Strauss  ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/Strauss-Resta ... sHiero.pdf
Military Coupe
Agent Blowmann'
Declaration of Independence
Freedom
Hope

ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/offtanshow12(1).mp3

[Anonymous]

I can't download the file Latin.  Anyone else have this problem?

**EDIT**  Now it's working  Must have been the upload in progress as why it wasn't

[LatinAmericanview]

It is up. This might be the best show yet. It has clarity. Enjoy!

[LatinAmericanview]

Canard basically this covers everything. You may want to skip to 21min mark. This where I get into the heart of the matter.

[Anonymous]

A great supplement, and nice ender with the Declaration of Independence.  

Of note, as I understand it to be a key to retaining freedom and justice for all, is that the states were independent of each other and were to be completely self-governed.  The US government is now an aberration on this principle, since it oversees and imposes its rule on them all. I am of the opinion that the smallest independent body is the most successful and able to protect its citizens and their interests.  The bigger the governance gets, the more complicated it becomes, and the more the independence of each person is lost to accommodate the "democratic" rule of the majority.

Peace.

[Anonymous]

Here is a short audio clip under 4 minutes that briefly explains the engineered beginnings of the shift from lawful order - using a perversion of the constitutional law through mind control - to bring about the necessary mechanisms for people to accept the forthcoming Caesarian tyrannical order.  By bringing the populace into becoming more amoral or immoral you create the required environment for a tyrannical rule to not only be acceptable, but necessary.

ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/Inciting.the.Caesarian.rule.mp3

Most of us know this already, but perhaps have not thought about it in the context of Latin's past two show.  A restatement will help clear up how it has happened

[Canard]

I'm speechless and near tears Latin, I have never come across such an articulate, thoughtful or genuine soul.  I have never felt so positive nor so inspired in the face of this enemy.  You remind me that the cliche is true ideas are bulletproof and timeless.  You have surely illustrated there is light at the end of the tunnel, literally a paradigm shift in my point of view has happened from this one show.  You've given this guy real hope.    From this perspective I know we can win, we can re-frame our arguments and inspire others to join us in our quest for Liberty's restoration.  Thank you Thank you Thank you a thousand times Thank you.

side note; homework for any of you who haven't seen it; An expose on Strauss; The Power of Nightmares.

http://conspiracycentral.net:6969/stats.html?info_hash=a6386d9010b1ab2c937f699db653125967d10d60

[kolnidre]

I'm speechless and near tears Latin, I have never come across such an articulate, thoughtful or genuine soul.  I have never felt so positive nor so inspired in the face of this enemy.  You remind me that the cliche is true ideas are bulletproof and timeless.  You have surely illustrated there is light at the end of the tunnel, literally a paradigm shift in my point of view has happened from this one show.  You've given this guy real hope.    From this perspective I know we can win, we can re-frame our arguments and inspire others to join us in our quest for Liberty's restoration.  Thank you Thank you Thank you a thousand times Thank you.

That's some heavy praise, indeed! I was going to wait a while to listen, but now I'm going to have to load up the iPod and listen as I do some training. Hope I'm half as inspired after listening.

[Anonymous]

Here are some more audios that will illustrate what Latin has been talking about.  Now this is all stuff I assume everyone knows about, but just think about it now in the context of the information presented.

ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/Controlling.Thought.Morality.and.History.mp3
ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/Corrupting.Governance.from.Within.to.Establish.Accepted.Tyranny.mp3

[shZ]

I'm really impressed by the standard of your shows. Kudos. I have one comment though, I would consider my base axiomatic perspective to be rationalism but I am a theist and thus have an "irrational" belief in God, so I'm not a 'true' rationalist. One minor disagreement I have with is your definition of a belief in God as some type of self-assured knowledge or "proof" of God? Since when did a 'belief' translate to any form of self-proclaimed 'knowledge' or any sort of 'proof'? For one thing, given the descriptions of God in the three main monotheistic faiths, it can easily be inferred that human language doesn't have the capacity to define God. Sine you seem well versed in philosophy and logic, you should easily be able to follow this argument. How do you prove the existence of something you can't define? In a logical framework, all descriptions of God would become obsolete if using human language, which is limited, or via symbolism, you could somehow define God. Sorry about the tangent, but it's just something I found interesting and was curious what your response will be.

[mobes]

"The truth cannot be told because people are incapable of understanding it, or incapable of dealing with it......."

There is alot of truth to this statement. However the problem now is, people are too busy being entertained and "educated" to truly understand what is happening around them. I mean just telling the average person that there is a conspiracy against them, they can't handle that information and call people like us conspiracy theorists.

I believe there will come a time when people will want the truth. When will that be? When the entire world is emerged in nuclear war, food and water shortages, riots in the streets in ALL countries and the complete destruction of all our liberties and freedoms.

But my question is - will the sheep care? Their rights and freedoms are being taken away on a daily basis. I guess the masons had a point when they said that the complete truth cannot be told because people have been indoctrinated not to care.....

[LatinAmericanview]

"The truth cannot be told because people are incapable of understanding it, or incapable of dealing with it......."

This is a misrepresentation of the argument.  Some people are incapable of handling the truth because they are to stupid.   (i.e Can you teach calculus to a monkey?)

There is alot of truth to this statement. However the problem now is, people are too busy being entertained and "educated" to truly understand what is happening around them. I mean just telling the average person that there is a conspiracy against them, they can't handle that information and call people like us conspiracy theorists.

Ignorance is no excuse.  Is someone pointing a gun to their heads forcing them to watch?

I believe there will come a time when people will want the truth. When will that be? When the entire world is emerged in nuclear war, food and water shortages, riots in the streets in ALL countries and the complete destruction of all our liberties and freedoms.

Never! When Human beings are struggling for their daily rations they will be to cold,to hungry and to scared to be interested in the truth.

But my question is - will the sheep care? Their rights and freedoms are being taken away on a daily basis. I guess the masons had a point when they said that the complete truth cannot be told because people have been indoctrinated not to care.....

Sort of. The real limiting factors on truth seeking are capacity and desire.  Indoctrination is certainly a large part but it is only a factor and not necessarily the defining one.

[mobes]

" Ignorance is no excuse.  Is someone pointing a gun to their heads forcing them to watch?

The answer is no, but when (almost) everyone does, it seems normal. Whatever event takes place by 2012 whether it be a natural disaster(s), economic collapse, biological attack, "alien" invasion, nuclear war(s), food and water shortages or a combination of these - let's not forget that whatever "solution" is put forth for the people of the planet will only benefit the people at the top (as is always with the problem reaction solution paradigm). The only difference now, is that this will be for all of humanity. (correct me if I'm wrong...)

[LatinAmericanview]

" Ignorance is no excuse.  Is someone pointing a gun to their heads forcing them to watch?

The answer is no, but when (almost) everyone does, it seems normal. Whatever event takes place by 2012 whether it be a natural disaster(s), economic collapse, biological attack, "alien" invasion, nuclear war(s), food and water shortages or a combination of these - let's not forget that whatever "solution" is put forth for the people of the planet will only benefit the people at the top (as is always with the problem reaction solution paradigm). The only difference now, is that this will be for all of humanity. (correct me if I'm wrong...)

I don't know what the time scale is. The US must collapse before we progress into  another stage.  I simply don't know but I suspect that these plans are close to actualization.

[GordZilla]

Latin,

 Jumping right in again, this may be lengthy;


Ok so it's a deserved 'government' because the people allowed themselves to be corrupted?  Ok so who corrupted them? And by removing what? In America and most colonized nations the answers would be; Talmudic Jews and by removing religion (specifically Christianity) .    That'd be the truth of it.  They poisoned the fruit and you'd blame the fruit for being poisoned?


There is no 'hope' in the scenario of a rule of reason, not with human nature being as it is. Science and reason allows little for error. And to get there you hope millions would be culled? This is your hope? Man is not humbled while no authority is perceived above them, instead his arrogance flourishes. This would not, and does not, make for a good leader only a good dictator (or Cesar if you prefer ). We ARE ALL liable only to the creator – not another man's ideas - this is the essence of what gives freedom for all of us (well it did for a brief period).  Understand the Declaration of Independence. Understand why the Creator and God are so important in this declaration, and the constitution of the U.S.A.  Do you know why Christian women wore white gloves in the fifties? To remind themselves not to eat in public least someone less fortunate should see.  The writer of the Declaration himself knew well of the Talmudic Jew. (Jefferson ...man I wish there were more of these  real wise men left around today, sure do miss them!). These are the morals they first had to destroy, this whole Christian notion of loving thy neighbor, standing up for truth, the belief in all are equal under God,  always trying to be honest without ever bearing false witness and, most importantly, their common knowledge of the deception practiced by the Jewish folk. These 'God fearing Christians of old' are the folk who are responsible for so many of the apt stereo types placed on the Talmudic Jew , the ones still used today. Where did they get such knowledge, these 'common peasant folk'? They had better insight into their character than most possess today, but how? All this had to be removed. And it was – (virtually) entirely,  you are the product of that and so are the 'churchies' you apparently dislike so much.


To look at this from another angle, we all know they have been kicked out of numerous countries numerous times. These countries were almost exclusively Christian. Now you could argue that it's because of the Christian doctrine's promotion of distrust and weariness for the Talmudic Jew, to which I'd say; 'Exactly!'. Do you think this will happen in the now secular countries, now after Christianity has been marginalized and turned into the 'lovey-dovey churchy' thing we see now?  OF COURSE NOT!!.  Or maybe you'd argue it was just certain members of these countries that made it happen, the rulers for example.  This again would not be true. These events usually followed the collapse of the ruling (or elite ) class or by popular pressure on the ruling class to have it done –either way these expulsions were almost exclusively put in to motion by the grass roots Christian population. People who knew that all are equal under God and could instantly recognize the arrogance of those that didn't.  Simply by their deeds and what the good book told them to consider wrong.  You know things like; usury, deceit, pride,  sexual perversion, secrecy, murder etc etc. They love the idea of secularized countries. They usher it in,  and promote it where ever they can (barring Israel).
 
 You want a 'tool' for this fight?  There you go.  And  as I've  repeatedly  suggested before YOU ALREAY HAVE ONE!! Even better, it's been repeatedly PROVEN to work! Your offering, a course of action (or rather inaction), will do nothing to arm the average person for what is to come, it will only help them describe it (intelligently and articulately, granted). God's solution has worked close to a hundred times now, and the lowliest of low can understand it. It unites thousands to millions against blatant evil in a way that has never been, and will likely ever again be, surpassed. (Again I'm referring to real God fearing Christians, not the hop, skip, 'Sunday comes to clean my sins' churchies you see everywhere. These People are only empty shells of what Christians once were). You will do nothing by studying Strauss and other philosophers  in regards to helping to identify those responsible for our current predicament. Nothing at all...all you can do is describe, with great style and articulation I will concede, what you suspect will happen. But what's becoming transparent to me is you will help no one in the REAL fight with this type of vainglorious rhetoric.  So please quit attacking the very people who might actually be able to help us in this fight, and quit celebrating and praising those that DO NOTHINIG!!!  If you would promote that Book (the Book – don't ask which version  .. you know now) , and have people re-visit it to see exactly what it says of Talmudic Jews, then you will actually help. If we could change our nations back to Christian nations once again, then maybe you may see justice come to these people by once again having them expelled. Rest assured, without them the masons will crumble.  However this is not in the cards, their damage to our religion is already complete except for us 'die hards' ...good news for you though , we'll be the first to go AS WE ARE THE MOST DANGEROUS TO THEM AS PROVEN TO THEM REPEATEDLY IN THE PAST. You are safe, you're secular and promote the idea of Masons being the real force --- they are loving you.


 This notion of some truths being too hard for some to bear is another red herring in your (or Strauss's ...seems you almost share the same opinions) conclusions. As no truth would be hard to bear if known by all and from the beginning. (Is knowing that you'll die hard to bear? If you dwell on it maybe, but since a few years after birth most of us know its true but it barely reaches our conscious in our day to day lives. And what a horrible truth, yet we handle it – ALL OF US). In other words if it were not hidden in the first place, and I mean the very first place, it wouldn't be a shock to anyone to hear it now. The only reason Strauss's notion holds true now is because they've held back truths for so long all the while promoting lies, worse than lies – lies with an agenda. It's that second part that makes hearing the truth later, after being lied to for so long, become shocking.  You can see this over and over in so many analogies. From when you first realized Santa is not real to things like the truth about 911. The truth about 911, in fact, has some that still can't handle it, the 'Santa' thing we usually get over. If they were told right from the start, would there be the shock that they suffer from now when they learn? Now after all the lies that have been built on top of it?  By 'being told the truth '  I mean all the truth;  Israelis deception, Mossad involvement in American politics etc. and right from the start.  Do you think they wouldn't be able to handle it? I personally think they wouldn't have tolerated it!  Hiding the truth is necessary only so corruption can reign ...not to spare the weaker minded ones - as the 'mass ignorance' were experiencing is also of their doing. The ONLY power knowledge can have over others is in their not knowing of it. But once revealed it becomes quickly impotent.

 The only other reason for Talmudic Jews to create the masons, apart from them being useful tools of theirs, is to provide an ultimate and last ditch scapegoat for their crimes. I know this to be true, not from the help of Strauss but from someone who knew the score way better than Strauss ever will. Sure not with as many fancy big words, but with an accurate understanding of  their character that is STILL unrivaled. And still proven to be true by their every deed. I think you know who I'm talking about and p.s.; there is only one.  


 If you get offended, as you did last time, its probably because –as you said- people don't like have the carpet pulled from beneath their feet. Guess you don't either. But until you can address my original post in defense of the God believing people, and with something a little more solid than 'first I'd have to know which bible' (which since has been addressed for you ) than I'm afraid you cannot keep writing off the religious as idiots and not expect someone to rebuke it.  You may just have to rethink your own understanding of things...shit you might have to do that all alone too. Universities, like other programming stations, don't offer much help on this front.  I wonder why.


 Better yet just concede that you don't know, as you already have about other topics. Once you do that, than attacking the religious does start to sound hypocritical so you won't likely do it anymore. Stand by your own words and 'reserve judgment until you do know'.  (That's a burden I don't have to carry.  I know 'who' and 'what' but more importantly; ' why' and 'what's to come'. You cannot know the last two, but only because you won't explore it. But you do see enough of the 'what's to come'  to know it will be shitty and on that we agree. Please don't retort; 'thou shall not judge least be judged' as A) I know I will be and B) the context in which you used that phrase was not about people but ideologies) Perhaps another approach for you would be to distinguish between the 'brain washed churchies' and the real traditional God fearing Christians .... Because the latter are a valuable ally, I will argue the most valuable ally you could have.


 I didn't come to God easily, I wasn't born into it ...I was like any other well programmed teenager in North America of my generation  ...I was a atheist. In fact I hated Him. It was in 93 when I started to wake that I noticed the uncanny words of the bible, particularly in reference to Pharisees, scribes and merchants – often referred to as Talmudic Jews, it was then I realized;  'oh crap He could be real!'. 'This is where wisdom starts', and those aren't my words.

 
 To equate philosophy with wisdom is laughable at best. We are all potential philosophers all it takes is for someone to have the luxury of time to think on things , how you presume this makes one wise is beyond me. The dumbest of shits can be philosophers. They can 'think' on the stupidest of concepts for their entire lives but yet never attain wisdom. This is not to say a philosopher can't be wise, but it is to say that philosophy is no license to wisdom, anymore than education is. Wisdom is wrought only from experience and intelligence.  Education is not the same as intelligence, it can be an aid to intelligence certainly, but it's more often than not a hindrance. If fact this is why often the most intelligent humans we've ever known usually dropped out of school or never went at all ( but this is another debate entirely). Intelligence is something you born with, a gift, it is your inherent ability to learn, predict, ascertain and act.  Philosophers have done VERY LITTLE to help the human cause throughout history. Furthermore if we all took the time to ponder everything, not much of anything would ever be done - wise people already know this. Right from the get-go
philosophy has been right up there in the list of silly sciences. It's almost entirely useless in its practicality.

 
 Our house has been set on fire, the philosopher's response; "I wonder where fire comes from?" "How hot do you think that is burning?" "I wonder if ... "
The wise man's response; "Let's put it out and find and punish those responsible"


 Your method, although it will enlighten people to philosophy, will do nothing to recognize the guilty and to have them punished. God's method will enable you to see and smell them right from their first words, every time. Living in God's word leaves them no wiggle room at all, leaving in the age of scientific reason is an open invitation to their utter dominance.
 

 I know you may argue that you stated all that you have in the hopes we can understand our enemy and their psychology better - so that we may defeat them from within, take out the pillars. And I sure hope our little minds are sufficient enough to keep up with you. (Ok that was sarcasm, but you do come off sounding quite pompous when you speak of such 'heady' things especially to anyone who you've already repeatedly insulted). God believing people 'couldn't think their way out of a wet paper bag' . Funny thing is this one stumped you awhile ago.  But I'll put to you again if you are looking to understand your enemy and their motives a little better, go to the first and still the best source ...all that's stopping you is your bias, maybe pride and your fear of being proved wrong.  It's all in there, Latin. Was it written by masons to damn Talmudic Jews? Was it written by Talmudic Jews to damn themselves and masons? Come on!


 You suggest we wait? What for, to get to know their names threw the study of Strauss?   I'm preparing to fight, I know who my enemy is. Unfortunately I also know when the 'shit hits the fan' they'll take flight. However I'll admit I do know that order out of chaos is one concept you talk about that will pan out. It will happen, and it's in this chaos that I'm preparing to fight. For it's here that I'll be forced to. As for justice for those that take flight, well rest assured it'll be served. Maybe now you'll understand His words were not to strike fear into you, but to give you real hope; 'Vengeance is mine, so saith the Lord' As murder is still a sin for us, killing in defense is not.


 I know this is an impossible dream, I admit that openly, but if we all stuck to the word of God they'd be impotent, game over for them ... oh wait He says don't practice usury ...oh shit for them ... oh wait He says do not go where I wouldn't be welcome, shitty for Masonic enrollment numbers, Etc . You can literally go on and on, but virtually all the life lessons in that book, if practiced by everyone, would make lies and deceit and eventually their practitioners obsolete. And if more people held true to it, as they generally used to, we would also continue to slow their progress towards our damnation.  History repeats only because the good Christians always catch up to them, then expel them, then repeat. However this time around, with mass world media control, this will not happen.  This time around there is little to no resistance –even from the so called 'Christians' by which I mean the 'churchies'. Welcome to our enslavement! Esau  has lifted his brother's yoke.  I'm glad to believe in God. Although people like me will certainly be murdered, most likely first. They hate, above all, those that have faith in Jesus. I still plan to remind them just before they pull the trigger of that old reframe; " Jesus loves you". We just may not have to become slaves afterall, just the dirt you'll get to till.


"Count my Blessings" You say , 'good' and 'bad' you term.  It's ingrained in even you. Perfect science will not allow for such fanciful words and phrases but what are the morals of the 'scientific reason' new world?  Or are they just not needed?   Just as morals, would humans also become not needed?  On these 'final days of perceived freedom' predictions we are both right in our respective positions,  i.e.; we are screwed.

-Gord

P.S.  Sorry for it's length, but to be understood in a conversation such as this, as you well know, it's needed.





"Don't tell me what the poets been doing, on the street in the epitome of vague.
Don't tell me how the universe is altered, when you find out how he gets paid."   The Tragically Hip - Poets

[Canard]

I listened to the show again and have some general notes. Hopefully this doesn't come across as just ramblings but someone can find it useful as a reaction to the most recent podcast. If I'm going over areas covered in the accompanying reading I apologize in advance.

I think I'd like to hear more on the scientific dictatorship how nature is harnessed and used against the populace the more technology 'advances'.  

Speaking of loving Ceasar I think blood and circus might be the same theme you are describing and the Iraq war is part of that.  Many people love that the Us Army is (pardon the forthcoming) Kicking them A-rabs asses and showin them the US of A can still get 'er done.  I think the audacity of our leader, the blood he spills is key kinda in the way chicks dig jerks, the populace secretly love an asshole president. Some anyway.

There is a film called 7 days in may for those interested in this idea of the military coup coming in to stop an insane leadership.

I'd like to know more on the jews as an administrative class.  I'm familiar with the term, but I know there are chronicles out there, somewhere, if you dont know off the top of your head latin, perhaps thats something we can all dig up on TIU?

This whole concept of the freemasonic jewish element cajoling, changing and manipulating the laws and standard to keep all the plates in the air, is very well illustrated by something etched in among the masonry work at the Yale School of Law something to the effect of 'the laws are not permanent, they can be changed'.  I had run out of batteries when I happened across it, ill be uploading it soon.  If ever some of my freemasonry photo scavenger hunting came in to play, it would tbe here.

The nature of belief, there is a much narrower gap between the logic found in your arguments as opposed to the beliefs of these religious zealots both jewish and christian who make up this surmountable force on the other side of this discussion.  Not to mention their emotionalism. Just an observation, I believe if more of us used that as a guide we'd make more progress in a shorter time span.

Thanks for reading.

[Canard]

Gordo,
I cant help but tell you that you are doing what you did during the last shows thread, please don't turn this into a theology class.  TIU is a rational, logical area of discussion and a rarity.  I don't feel any of your post in this thread is useful or relevant.  I don't mean to be rude but you are 'spreading the good news' when we are trying to be detectives on the case.  HELP US!!! don't complain we don't believe in god.  I respect your right to your beliefs, I don't believe you respect mine or that of others on this forum, whose theme again is rational debate not theological theories.  This is where calling faith an obsession or a mind virus is valid. I'm sorry but that's all you contribute if you can't respect that no one wants to be preached to I'm going to have to just put you on ignore.  I suspect most people don't read your posts, I'm just being honest not trying to hurt your feelings. I have no interest in proponents of Christianity and I fail to see how what happens after we die will help us solve a bank robbery (for lack of a better metaphor).

[GordZilla]

Gordo,
I cant help but tell you that you are doing what you did during the last shows thread, please don't turn this into a theology class.  TIU is a rational, logical area of discussion and a rarity.  I don't feel any of your post in this thread is useful or relevant.  I don't mean to be rude but you are 'spreading the good news' when we are trying to be detectives on the case.  HELP US!!! don't complain we don't believe in god.  I respect your right to your beliefs, I don't believe you respect mine or that of others on this forum, whose theme again is rational debate not theological theories.  This is where calling faith an obsession or a mind virus is valid. I'm sorry but that's all you contribute if you can't respect that no one wants to be preached to I'm going to have to just put you on ignore.  I suspect most people don't read your posts, I'm just being honest not trying to hurt your feelings. I have no interest in proponents of Christianity and I fail to see how what happens after we die will help us solve a bank robbery (for lack of a better metaphor).

Then you comprehended nothing I wrote and only went ahead an concluded what you wished. I just gave the best way to beat them ... as proven repeatedly in the past and you refer to that as a waste of time? Not Helping?  Not relavent? And as for insult,  how is it insults directed to those that do believe in God is ok, but preceived  insults of those that don't isn't?

Nice, but you have no answer to the VERY relevant questions I have posted, and as for wasting time ? Read Strauss.
I am trying to help, more than you obviously realize.

-Gord

What? Can it only be a philosopy class?

Oh and "after we die"  I said I'd be the dirt.  Yeah, you didn't read a bit of it did you?