TFC 28th June 09 guests Rafeeg & Ognir- ZioMoon Landing Hoax

[Ognir]

Daryl Bradford Smith (http://www.iamthewitness.com
Ognir (http://www.theinfounderground.com)

Recorded 28th June 09
Guests Rafeeg & Ognir

Zio Moon Land Hoax
Hollywood
Programming of the Masses
Chemtrails
Jewish Slavery Business
Police State
7/7 and the BBC
Michel Jackson
and lots more

http://theinfounderground.com/archives/ ... n.Hoax.mp3

[CrackSmokeRepublican]

ZioMoon  

---

Here's a fresh one from Jewcy:

http://www.jewcy.com/post/first_jew_moon%E2%80%A6

When I was incarcerated at Boron aka Watergate Camp, only a couple hours from L.A., there were a few inmates connected to Hollywood. One of them was Seth Jaffe, an actor who had guest starred on TV series like "Cagney & Lacey" and "Remington Steele." He was also a very funny writer. So the warden allowed us to put on a comedy show in front of the 700 inmates. One of our skits went like this...

You all saw the landing on the moon, July 21, 1969. Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin were the first men to walk on the moon, right? Actually, I, Craig Glazer, was the first man on the moon. Here's how it happened... The lunar module had just touched down when Houston called us: "This is Mission Control, we have a problem. The lunar surface where you have landed may be unstable, too dangerous for you to step down on." We were crushed. All of our work was for nothing! But then Mission Control called again and only spoke to Neil and Buzz: "We have an idea. Send the Jewish kid down first." I go down the stairs onto the surface of the moon. I check things out and everything seems safe. That's when Neil lowers a camera to me and I film him jumping onto the surface.

Don't believe me? Think about it. How the hell do you think they got that film of him coming down the stairs? The cameraman! That was me--the first Jew on the moon!

Even the goyem laughed--and considering this was federal prison that was almost everyone.

Craig Glazer, author of The King Of Sting: The Amazing True Story of a Modern American Outlaw, is guest blogging on Jewcy.  Tomorrow he'll publish his parting post.  Stay tuned.

[rmstock]

The Moon Landing was a massive public brain washing campaign, comparable
with H.G. Wells' "War of the Worlds" radio broadcast done by Orson Wells on October 30, 1938.

But that's actually old stuff, as is the moonlanding. What matters is the Climate Change Hoax.
We must fight the Climate Change Hoax as the consequence of its measures, The Cap and Trade Bill,
will be that human life and nature will disappear from the Earth's surface. Here's my perception of whats
 going on with Congress and Obama pushing the Cap and Trade Bill through. What I present here is
an expose of WHY Al Gore introduced his Global Warming hoax :

Dune for Dummies

It wouldn't surprise me if NASA has been a public P.R. Department of
the CIA/NSA from the day of its inception. Everything concerning Mars
can then be found back under the file OPERATION DUNE. It may sound
silly, but .... In the sixties the public was suddenly presented with a
Dune Buggy on the basis of a Volkswagen Beetle ... with which people
who were totally hyped up of the Moon-landing, could replay this on
their favorite beach. Not much later a complete arsenal of Cult movies
was launched, under the name ... 'Dune' ...

Dune (1973)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0217408/
Dune (1984)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0087182/
"Dune" (2000) (TV mini-series)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0142032/
"Children of Dune" (2003)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0287839/
Dune (2010)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1160419/


Well, the story of Dune is indeed happening in the Desert, where a
giant worm is sliding through the sand, and leaves behind a thing
called 'spice' (ehh worm faeces?), which means life and food for the
people trying to survive. This worm is then declared holy inside the 'Dune'
cult series.

Here's the conspiracy : There's two factions : People who promote the
Desert culture, and people who want to see plants and nature and thus
don't need that big worm anymore. My perception is that life on Mars is
determined by these 'Dune' worms (if there is life on Mars), where on
planet Earth we are still independent.

The battle we are waging today is to prevent Desertification from
happening. This looks like a impossible task, most certainly now Al
Gore has started his 'Global Warming' campaign, where CO2 has to
disappear from our atmosphere ...

One of the many innocent victims of todays education is of course
Biology class. Who would know today that in order to grow plants and
crops ABOVE the ground, one needs CO2 in the atmosphere and :

sun-light (or other light ... thousand points of light?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photosynthesis :

CO2 + 2H2O ==> CH4 + 2O2 == plants + oxygen



If there already are underground life-communities, one can locate these
by localizing its air flows; where air is entering the ground and where
air is flowing out of the ground. What one has todo is to measure the
concentration of CO2 entering the ground and of air which reappears
into the atmosphere.

If the CO2 concentration in the air which enters our atmosphere is
SMALLER as of the air going into the ground, then someone is tanking
CO2 underground, in order to, of course, grow fruits and vegetables there.

What Al Gore is doing now, with his Global Warming campaign, is
to declare that the process of extracting CO2 from the atmosphere
is a normal thing todo. What many don't seem to know or realize is that
CO2 capture from the atmosphere has as hard consequence, that
our nature will disappear from the Earth's surface.

Conclusion, Al Gore seems to be a big fan of Dune worms. But who
has ever seen such a worm slide through the Desert? Not me! So the
entire Gore campaign is in fact meant to transform our planet Earth
into Mars version II. The entire Matrix trilogy is closely dough-tailing
with this, the Nazi Black Sun ideology ditto. Further the observation
that there's quite a number of New Age 'specialists' out there, who
denounce Sun-worshipers as being of the devil.

Robert
PS. the most straight forward explanation: the atmosphere will be
     diluted of CO2 to such an extend that crops, fruits and vegetables
     will only grow underground inside the underground cities of the
     large food corporations. Hence they will control all food on the Earth's
     surface.
--
Robert M. Stockmann - RHCE
Network Engineer - UNIX/Linux Specialist
crashrecovery.org  mailto:stock@stokkie.net">stock@stokkie.net

[satya]

I do not understand why focusing on the moon landing is pivotal to the anti-Zionist movement.  In fact, it maybe harmful since so many people believe this as fact and is just one more thing to convince the general public that is not true, when we already have an uphill battle.  It is also suspicious that Eric Hufschmidt made the moon landing hoax as so important to his agenda.  This maybe counterproductive.

[LordLindsey]

You must not even have LISTENED before making a comment because Noel, Daryl, and Rafeeq DID NOT GO FAR ENOUGH IN THE EVIDENCE FOR THE HOAX.

Listen first--COMMENT LATER.

LINDSEY

NB:  I don't give two shits what people advocating the moon landing have to say any longer because the astronauts WERE CAUGHT FAKING BEING HALF-WAY TO THE MOON on the video "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" newest version, and I don't have to know anything else but THAT--except for the van Allen Radiation Belts that are so deadly that the astronauts in CURRENT DAY can not even get within 400 miles of the belt before their eyes are bombarded with radiation that they can actually see in their corneas!   :lol:  :roll:  :!:

[CrackSmokeRepublican]

All I can say is that the Money for NASA has been wasted for decades. I'm sure it is "lost accounting" no different from the US military "losing" over a trillion dollars and announcing it just before 9/11. Where did the money go?
From the connection to the US military, you see firms like Texas Instruments (Cecil Green) growing as suppliers to the US Military Industrial complex - NASA.

While it might be hard to convince most people in believing the Moon-Hoax as a conspiracy -- the money dropped on this adventure doesn't make a lot of sense -- in a practical sense, unless you believe a select group is getting a very large chunk of public funds for their Projects as directed by Zio-types.  There are a lot of NeoCon-Crypto-Zionist types in the mix surrounding NASA.
Jim Marrs-Joseph P Farrell-Jim Hoagland all believe the weird secrecy around NASA is the devious "Nazi International".  I can easily see a "Zionist-Take The Money International" really running things behind the scenes.  

Faking it for TV consumption really would not have been that difficult. Faking the working histories of 10,000s of people working on the Moon Projects might be difficult and risky. A lot of people had a Grandfather or Older Uncle who worked at NASA.  

It is risky to push this but it could really expose the Zionist Public Cash Fountain (NASA historically) if there is enough evidence to really expose it as largely a Hoax -- missiles launched, satellites launched certainly,  but NOT Moon travel .   They could have launched empty missiles into space in Florida.  The military and intelligence agencies got a huge political boost from it in the Cold War -- NASA's Moon Missions were a "win-win" for the political West and even the US Jew run University industry.

I largely stopped paying much attention to this Moon Hoax theory but will revisit it since Ognir, DBS and Rafeeq have discussed it.  There has been a lot of research concerning the Moon Hoax from a lot of respectable people long before the 1970s ended -- long before Hufschmidt brought it up too.

[GordZilla]

The moon hoax documentary that Rafeeq mentions actually has this line in it's credits;

"No Goy were hurt during the making of this documentary"

no joke.

[satya]

You must not even have LISTENED before making a comment because Noel, Daryl, and Rafeeq DID NOT GO FAR ENOUGH IN THE EVIDENCE FOR THE HOAX.

Listen first--COMMENT LATER.

LINDSEY

NB:  I don't give two shits what people advocating the moon landing have to say any longer because the astronauts WERE CAUGHT FAKING BEING HALF-WAY TO THE MOON on the video "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" newest version, and I don't have to know anything else but THAT--except for the van Allen Radiation Belts that are so deadly that the astronauts in CURRENT DAY can not even get within 400 miles of the belt before their eyes are bombarded with radiation that they can actually see in their corneas!   :lol:  :roll:  :!:

Listened...no change in my comment.  Although, CrackSmoke makes a good point about NASA being a money pit.  We already have plenty of relevant evidence to go directly after the Jewish criminal network instead of this roundabout manner.  Also, we need to stop focusing speaking to the 'conspiracy' subculture and start aiming at the general public.

[Ognir]

I had no idea of the topic prior to the recording,  but directly afterwards I said WTF :lol:  EH will now make headlines about this :lol:

[LordLindsey]

Satya, I don't disagree with your points, please understand...but the PROOF that we never went to the moon is more than enough--just watch the documentary "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" and you will understand what I am saying.  If THIS lie was perpetraed upon the American people, THEN WHY IN THE HELL DIDN'T THE ENEMIES OF AMERICA TELL THE TRUTH AND DESTROY THE CREDIBILITY OF THEIR ENEMY?  NOW do you understand why this is so important?  It shows that this entire "nation states-at-conflict" worldview IS A LIE!  

The moon hoax shows more clearly than anything else that the entire world in which we live is THEATER, and if you can't see the reason for showing that the moon landing was a hoax and WHY IT IS SO CRITICIAL--I have just given it to you.

LINDSEY

NB:  You can find the video in full if you go to the right places to find it online.

[satya]

Satya, I don't disagree with your points, please understand...but the PROOF that we never went to the moon is more than enough--just watch the documentary "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" and you will understand what I am saying.  If THIS lie was perpetraed upon the American people, THEN WHY IN THE HELL DIDN'T THE ENEMIES OF AMERICA TELL THE TRUTH AND DESTROY THE CREDIBILITY OF THEIR ENEMY?  NOW do you understand why this is so important?  It shows that this entire "nation states-at-conflict" worldview IS A LIE!  

The moon hoax shows more clearly than anything else that the entire world in which we live is THEATER, and if you can't see the reason for showing that the moon landing was a hoax and WHY IT IS SO CRITICIAL--I have just given it to you.

LINDSEY

NB:  You can find the video in full if you go to the right places to find it online.

I understand your point but here is mine: 1) Most people do not even think about the moon landing anymore, 2) How many steps do you have to take to connect to the Zionists?, and 3) 9/11 is a direct connection to Zionists with tons of evidence and the public is already skeptical of the official story.  This is a much better topic to expose the theater.

[memory hole]

didn't Daryl always used to refuse to discuss the moon hoax?

I can't beleive this shit till I see it form the horses mouth.

Wheres the Kissenger video, can't seem to locate it?

[Ognir]

Nope that was the other Hoax he doesn't talk about

I'm still waiting for the name of the Docu from Rafeeg or Daryl

[mgt23]

@crack is there an official story on how they filmed neil going down the stair of the craft for the first time? i too found this killer as well as a billion other things. i think they do have unmanned probes there however but the main budget of nasa is black ops and probably just plain ol stolen. the goal of the zionism is to anti-work you as a form of worship to thier devil-as the devil apparently strives for anti-creation. This is in line with my theory on anti-creation and the destruction of existence via baryon tunnelling. So in fact the wasting/anti-working/stealing going on is entirely relevent to the debate of zionism-propaganda is merely a side benefit. I'm not sure people truly appreciate this and its what i'm researching now in jewish occultism.

[memory hole]

DARK SIDE OF THE MOON - CBC Passionate Eye
How could the flag flutter when there's no wind on the moon? During an interview with Stanley Kubrick's widow an extraordinary
story came to light. She claims Kubrick and other Hollywood producers were recruited to help the U.S. win the high stakes race to
the moon. In order to finance the space program through public funds, the U.S. government needed huge popular support, and that
meant they couldn't afford any expensive public relations failures. Fearing that no live pictures could be transmitted from the
first moon landing, President Nixon enlisted the creative efforts of Kubrick, whose 2001: a Space Odyssey (1968) had provided much
inspiration, to ensure promotional opportunities wouldn't be missed. In return, Kubrick got a special NASA lens to help him shoot
Barry Lyndon (1975). A subtle blend of facts, fiction and hypothesis around the first landing on the moon, Dark Side Of The Moon
illustrates how the truth can be twisted by the manipulation of images.
With use of 'hijacked' archival footage, false documents, real interviews taken out of context or transformed through voice-over
or dubbing, staged interviews, as well as, interviews with astronauts like Buzz Aldrin and others, Dark Side Of The Moon navigates
the viewer through lies and truth; fact and fiction. This is no ordinary documentary. Its intent is to inform and entertain the
viewer, but also to shake him up - make him aware that one should always view television with a critical eye.

Dark Side Of The Moon is written and directed by William Karel and co-produced by Point du Jour Production and ARTE France. IMDB:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0344160/

thats the movie i not seen it, getting now.

Im just confused why Rafeeq and Daryl are bringing this up now, its from 2002?

http://isohunt.com/torrent_details/9302 ... ab=summary

[LordLindsey]

NO ONE has addressed the film that is even much more important than this, "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon."  Why is that?  WATCH IT and come back and tell me that we went to the moon AT ALL--AT ANY TIME--and how we were able to do it...

LINDSEY

NB:  HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS is gone over a pack of lies, and THIS ONE is just as important as all of the others--maybe even more so because the world was supposed to be black-and-white in those days when everyone knew who the "good" guys were, so why didn't the "bad" guys tell what many, many people are now starting to see conclusively?

[LordLindsey]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOMHSgQuuiw

Watch the whole thing, but I think that there may be an updated version, but you will have to find it elsewhere.  This movie explains the whole story and even if one or two points can be refuted, THE VIDEO SHOWING THE ASTRONAUTS FAKING GOING HALF-WAY TO THE MOON THAT IS OFFICIAL FOOTAGE FROM NASA--CAN NOT.

LINDSEY

[memory hole]

Linsey, I have seen that documentary, and yeah it does seem to blow the story wide open.

I don't get why its of any important now, with the shit going on in Palestine and Iran.

Seems like flogging a dead horse to me.

 

[satya]

I don't have any evidence of Zionist involvement in the cover-up or for the reasons of the cover-up, but it is important because it shows how lies upon lies upon lies are inflicted upon the people, and for THIS to be shown to be a lie--well, if a person can admit that this is a lie then if someone is not open to the BIGGER issues of Zionism, then they would be more than likely to have an open-mind if they were convinced that the moon landing was a COMPLETE LIE.

That is not true at all, i.e. Alex Jones believers.

I don't get why its of any important now, with the shit going on in Palestine and Iran.

Seems like flogging a dead horse to me.

I completely agree.

[rmstock]

Rafeeg was refferring to the following video :

Opération Lune (c)2002 (dark side of the moon) William Karel

VIDEO:  [divx]  480x360  24bpp  29.970 fps  674.8 kbps (82.4 kbyte/s)
AUDIO: 44100 Hz, 2 ch, s16le, 128.0 kbit/9.07% (ratio: 16000->176400)
Runtime 52:14 mins

-rw-r--r--  1 stock stock 319698972 Jul  5  2006 DarkSideoftheMoon.avi
5df96e595c7823672d1731ad4bd511ee  DarkSideoftheMoon.avi

This video documents Stanley Kubricks involvement with the
Moon Landing. "In case something goes wrong on the Moon, You
Stanley will make the best watched footage ever. We cannot afford
to blow this ...."

A lot of crap is circulating on google video and youtube, emulating
this documentary. This is the original with the unmistaken, British
accent [tm] featured, BBC narrator.

http://tracker.conspiracycentral.net/to ... hp?id=7951

[CrackSmokeRepublican]

Here it is at Mininova:
http://www.mininova.org/tor/767384



BTW, the criminal Zionist Kissinger made a deal with Arabs in 1970s to force Arabs to borrow from US Banks -- a great interview:
http://www.howestreet.com/audiovideo/in ... layer/1262


The Neil Armstrong Museum has some good photos to look at if interested:
http://cache.virtualtourist.com/4107591 ... ton_DC.jpg

I'd be interested in knowing how they got this angle shot?  I guess it was "after" they "landed":


Shot of Lander:


Some Moon Fakery Charges:

WERE THE MOON LANDING SHOTS FAKED?
Shocking : See what NASA has done (Long but worth reading)

9 SPACE ODDITIES:
1. Apollo 14 astronaut Allen Shepard played golf on the Moon. In front of a worldwide TV audience, Mission Control teased him about slicing the ball to the right. Yet a slice is caused by uneven air flow over the ball. The Moon has no atmosphere and no air.

2. A camera panned upwards to catch Apollo 16's Lunar Lander lifting off the Moon. Who did the filming?

3. One NASA picture from Apollo 11 is looking up at Neil Armstrong about to take his giant step for mankind. The photographer must have been lying on the planet surface. If Armstrong was the first man on the Moon, then who took the shot?

4. The pressure inside a space suit was greater than inside a football. The astronauts should have been puffed out like the Michelin Man, but were seen freely bending their joints.

5. The Moon landings took place during the Cold War. Why didn't America make a signal on the moon that could be seen from earth? The PR would have been phenomenal and it could have been easily done with magnesium flares.

6. Text from pictures in the article said that only two men walked on the Moon during the Apollo 12 mission. Yet the astronaut reflected in the visor has no camera. Who took the shot?

7. The flags shadow goes behind the rock so doesn't match the dark line in the foreground, which looks like a line cord. So the shadow to the lower right of the spaceman must be the flag. Where is his shadow? And why is the flag fluttering if there is no air or wind on the moon?

8. How can the flag be brightly lit when its side is to the light? And where, in all of these shots, are the stars?

9. The Lander weighed 17 tons yet the astronauts feet seem to have made a bigger dent in the dust. The powerful booster rocket at the base of the Lunar Lander was fired to slow descent to the moons service. Yet it has left no traces of blasting on the dust underneath. It should have created a small crater, yet the booster looks like it's never been fired.

WERE THE MOON LANDING SHOTS FAKED?

In July 1969, more than 600 million people watched in awe, as Neil Armstrong became the first man to walk on the surface of the moon. The last men to set foot on the moon were the astronauts of Apollo 17, in December 1972. But even before this, a set of conspiracy theories were spreading, the most radical of which claimed that NASA had faked all the lunar landings-that man in fact never landed on the moon. Look at the evidence and decide for yourself.

This shot of Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin planting the
US flag on the moon's surface was taken by a 16 mm
camera mounted on the lunar module. Aldrin's shadow (A)
is far longer than Armstrong's. Yet the only light on the
moon - and the only light source used by NASA - comes
from the sun, and should not create such unequal
shadows.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
Buzz Aldrin stands with the sun shining down across his left shoulder. Although his right side is in shadow, there is too much detail shown on that side of his space suit (B). It should be much darker and less visible because the contrast between light and dark is much greater on the moon. With no atmosphere to pollute the light on the moon, all the photographs should look bright and crisp. But the landscape behind Aldrin (C) gradually fades to darkness. This 'fall-off' effect, hoax theorists say, should not occur on the moon. But the fading effect could have happened because film is less adaptive than the human eye and makes objects seem darker the further they are from the camera. There is a curious object reflected in Aldrin's visor (D). Some theorists think that it is a helicopter, others say that it is a 12-metre glass structure. NASA claims that it is a piece of equipment on the lunar surface.



NASA claims the strange shape (E) - in this shot taken from the Lunar Module while it was 95 km above the moon's surface - is a shadow cast by the Command Module's rocket. But when larger aircraft fly at lower altitudes over the Earth, they do not cast such huge and defined shadows.



As the Lunar Module Antares, from Apollo 14, rests on the moon's surface there is no crater beneath its feet (F), despite the considerable amount of dust that would have been thrown up during its descent. There also appears to be a footprint (G) directly under the module, yet no one walked on this part of the moon before the craft landed. On the left side of the craft, the words, 'United States' (H) are clearly visible, whereas they should be in shadow. Buzz Aldrin himself said that there is no refracted light on the moon, which points to the fact that another source of light was used to take this shot.





These shots of John Young and James Irwin - like many Apollo photos - show a lunar sky without stars (J). Yet with no atmosphere on the moon, stars should be visible - a fact confirmed by Maria Blyzinsky, Curator of Astronomy at the Greenwich Observatory, London. If NASA could not hope to recreate the lunar sky, they may have opted for simple black backdrops. NASA claim that the sunlight was so strong it overpowered the light from the stars. On the shadow side of the landing modules, there are plaques (K) with the American flag and the words 'United States' quite bright and clearly visible, but the gold foil around the plaques is in near darkness. Studio spotlights highlighting these areas, or technicians retouching the prints, could have caused this effect.



As Alan Bean holds up a Special Environmental Sample Container, the top of his head is clearly in view. But the camera taking the shot was fixed on Charles Conrad's chest, and the ground here seems to be level, so the top of the helmet (L) should not be in the photo. Shadows visible in Al Bean's visor should not be in the photo. Shadows visible in Al Bean's visor (M) go off in various directions, not in straight parallel lines, as expected, suggesting that there is more than one light source. The container Bean is holding (N) is brightly lit at the bottom, yet it is facing away from the light. This may be due to the light reflected from Bean's suit on to the container, but the rest of the container is not so brightly lit.



In this photograph of John Young readjusting an antenna next to the Lunar Rover Vehicle (LRV), there is a marker, known as a cross-hair (inset) (P), that goes behind the LRV's equipment. These cross-hairs (Q), which appear on all the lunar photographs, are made by a screen of cross-hairs placed between the shutter and the film. The bright, reflected light may have obliterated the fine line of this one, or it could have happened if the image was retouched. The foreground shows what looks like the letter 'C' on a boulder (R). Is this perhaps an identification letter left on a studio prop? The letter C on the original photo is actually quite well defined and it is hard to imagine what can cause such a well-laid inscription on a boulder in a desolate place such as the moon. The tracks made by the LRV's wheel turn rather oddly at right-angles (S). These tracks could have been caused by studio technicians pushing the buggy into place. Such clear tracks and footprints require moisture to form and should not appear on the dry lunar surface.

http://fake-landing.blogspot.com/2007/0 ... -long.html

[LordLindsey]

They found the "missing videos!!!"  Now, isn't that just funny...just like the video "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon."  I see that NO ONE has mentioned the evidence in the video.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/110 ... ding-tapes

LINDSEY

[memory hole]

if they had landed on the moon in the 60's there would be a walmart there by now.

 :lol:

for that reason alone, its a scam.

[§N9sh2bj]

http://www.justin.tv/moonmovies some related clips.

[Free Truth]

Satya's posts here hit the nail on the head.

[CrackSmokeRepublican]

Welteislehre (World Ice Theory)

, also known as Glazial-Kosmogonie (Glacial Cosmogony) is a cosmological theory proposed by Hans Hörbiger, an Austrian engineer and inventor and respected steam engine designer, whose invention of the Hörbiger valve made him a wealthy man.

Hörbiger did not arrive at his theory through research, but said that he had received it in a "vision" in 1894. According to his theory, ice was the basic substance of all cosmic processes, and ice moons, ice planets, and the "global ether" (also made of ice) had determined the entire development of the universe.

 History

By his own account, Hörbiger was observing the Moon when he was struck by the notion that the brightness and roughness of its surface was due to ice. Shortly after, he experienced a dream in which he was floating in space watching the swinging of a pendulum which grew longer and longer until it broke. "I knew that Newton had been wrong and that the sun's gravitational pull ceases to exist at three times the distance of Neptune," he concluded.[1] He worked out his theory in collaboration with amateur astronomer and schoolteacher Philipp Fauth who he met in 1898, and published it as Glazial-Kosmogonie in 1912. Fauth had previously produced a large (if somewhat inaccurate) lunar map and had a considerable following, which lent Hörbiger's theory some respectability.[2]

It did not receive a great deal of attention at the time, but following World War I Hörbiger decided to change his strategy by promoting the new "cosmic truth" not only to people at universities and academies, but also to the general public. Hörbiger thought that if "the masses" accepted his ideas then they might put enough pressure on the academic establishment to force his theory into the mainstream. No effort was spared in popularising the theory: "cosmotechnical" societies were founded, which offered public lectures that attracted large audiences, there were cosmic ice movies and radio programs, and even cosmic ice journals and novels.[3]

The followers of the theory exerted a great deal of public pressure on behalf of the theory. The movement published posters, pamphlets, and books, and even a newspaper, The Key to World Events. A company owned by an adherent would only hire people who declared themselves convinced of the theory's truth. Some followers even attended astronomical meetings to heckle, shouting, "Out with astronomical orthodoxy! Give us Hörbiger!" During this period, the name was changed from the Graeco-Latin Glazial-Kosmogonie to the more Germanic Welteislehre (WEL for short).

One of the early supporters of Hörbiger's theories was Houston Stewart Chamberlain, the leading theorist behind the early development of the National Socialist Party in Germany in 1923.

Two organizations were set up in Vienna concerned with the theory, the Kosmotechnische Gesellschaft and the Hörbiger Institute. The first was formed in 1921 by a group of enthusiastic adherents of the Theory, which included engineers, physicians, civil servants, and businessmen. Most had been personally acquainted with Hörbiger, and had attended his many lectures. Among Hörbiger's followers was Viennese author Egon Friedell, who explained the World Ice Theory in his 1930 Cultural History of the Modern Age.[4]

In the Third Reich

After Hörbiger's death in 1931, the followers of WEL came to the conclusion that given the changing political situation in Germany, aligning the theory with National Socialism would eventually lead to its acceptance; WEL had already been heavily and successfully promoted as the "German antithesis" of the "Jewish" theory of relativity in the late 1920s. And so the movement became more and more pro-Nazi, with WEL supporters saying things like: "Our Nordic ancestors grew strong in ice and snow; belief in the Cosmic Ice is consequently the natural heritage of Nordic Man.", "Just as it needed a child of Austrian culture - Hitler! - to put the Jewish politicians in their place, so it needed an Austrian to cleanse the world of Jewish science.", and "the Führer, by his very life, has proved how much a so-called 'amateur' can be superior to self-styled professionals; it needed another 'amateur' to give us a complete understanding of the Universe."

Heinrich Himmler, one of the most powerful Nazi leaders, became a strong proponent of the theory and he stated that if it were corrected and adjusted with new scientific findings it could very well be accepted as scientific work. However, the Propaganda Ministry felt obliged to state that "one can be a good National Socialist without believing in the WEL."

Adolf Hitler, an enthusiastic follower of the WEL theory, adopted it as the Nazi party's official cosmology. He claimed that Hörbiger was not accepted by the scientific establishment because "the fact is, men do not wish to know."[5] The World Ice Theory was intended to form part of a planetarium Hitler planned to build on Linz's Mount Pöstling. According to the structure's plans, the ground floor was to centre around Ptolemey's universe, the middle floor Copernicus' theory, and the top floor, Hörbiger's theory.[4]

It has been said that the real reason both Hitler and Himmler favored the theory was to counterbalance the perceived Jewish influence on the sciences, similar to the Deutsche Physik movement. Hörbiger's theory was for instance opposed to Albert Einstein's theory of relativity. Dozens of scientific journals, books, and even novels were published on this topic. Hörbiger's theories became generally accepted among the population of Nazi Germany and a German Hörbiger Organization had thousands of members.

The Nazis also considered the World Ice Theory valuable because of its supposed value in weather forecasting. The 1938 Zur Welteismeteorologie ("On World Ice Meteorology") by Dr. E. Dinies, published by the Reichs Office for Weather Service quotes from Hörbiger's Glazial-Kosmogonie and provided tables of data comparing ice and air temperatures for relative humidity values.[6]

A growing group of 'believing scientists' expanded the theory during the last years of World War II.

Following the Anschluss of March 1938, the Kosmotechnische Gesellschaft was liquidated by the Nazis and its funds seized. The Hörbiger Institute, which was a small association which collected funds for research, was left in possession of all Hörbiger's scientific material, including a library and a large collection of valuable drawings covering astronomy, meteorology, and geology as they related to the Hörbiger Theory. The Nazis wanted to close the Institute down as well, but Alfred Hörbiger and the Chairman avoided this by having a Nazi Commission appointed. They also managed to prevent the archives being taken to Berlin and absorbed in Himmler's Ahnenerbe organization, and established that the Institute was the private property of Hörbiger's sons.

Despite the outbreak of World War II, Alfred Hörbiger managed to continue publishing the Institute's Proceedings, in spite of being cut off from all foreign publications and correspondents. Eventually they were contacted by the German Propaganda Ministry, who said they considered that the publications constituted high treason and ordered them to stop circulating their reports.

In February 1945 the Hörbiger engineering works were destroyed, and in March the Institute's premises were hit and were boarded up just before Soviet troops arrived. Alfred Hörbiger died in August 1945 but the Institute hoped to restart publication of its Proceedings by 1949.

Postwar

After World War II, the WEL cult dropped out of sight. But it revived sometime afterwards, and continued to have members in both Germany and England for several years, even though it was quickly discredited again. In the 1950s, a pamphlet supporting the WEL stated that "proof of the theory awaits the conclusion of the first successful interplanetary flight, a matter in which the Institute is greatly interested." A survey conducted in 1953 showed that over a million people in Germany, England, and the U.S. believed that Hörbiger was correct. More recently, some of its supporters have dropped the idea of an icy lunar surface, though they continue to support the view that it was captured and that its capture destroyed Atlantis.

Theory

According to the theory, the solar system had its origin in a gigantic star into which a smaller, dead, waterlogged star fell. This impact caused a huge explosion which flung fragments of the smaller star out into interstellar space where the water condensed and froze into giant blocks of ice. A ring of such blocks formed, which we now call the Milky Way, as well as a number of solar systems among which was our own, but with many more planets than presently exist.

Interplanetary space is filled with traces of hydrogen gas, which cause the planets to slowly spiral inwards, along with ice blocks. The outer planets are large mainly because they have swallowed a large number of ice blocks, but the inner planets have not swallowed nearly as many. One can see ice blocks on the move in the form of meteors, and when one collides with the Earth, it produces hailstorms over an area of many square kilometers, while when one falls into the Sun, it produces a sunspot and gets vaporized, making "fine ice," which covers the innermost planets.

It was also claimed that the Earth had had several satellites before it acquired the Moon; they began as planets in orbits of their own, but over long spans of time were captured one by one and slowly spiralled in towards the Earth until it disintegrated and its debris became part of the Earth's structure. One can supposedly identify the rock strata of several geological eras with the impacts of these satellites.

The last such impact, of the "Tertiary" or "Cenozoic Moon" and the capture of our present Moon, is supposedly remembered through myths and legends. This was worked out in detail by Hörbiger's English follower Hans Schindler Bellamy; Bellamy recounted how as a child he would often dream about a large moon that would spiral closer and closer in until it burst, making the ground beneath roll and pitch, awakening him and giving him a very sick feeling. When he looked at the Moon's surface through a telescope, he found its surface looking troublingly familiar. When he learned of Hörbiger's theory in 1921, he found it a description of his dream. He explained the mythological support he found in such books as Moons, Myths, and Man, In the Beginning God, and The Book of Revelation is History. It was believed that our current Moon was the sixth since the Earth began and that a new collision was inevitable. Believers argued that the great flood described in the Bible and the destruction of Atlantis were caused by the fall of previous moons.

Hörbiger had various responses to the criticism that he received. If it was pointed out to him that his assertions did not work mathematically, he responded: "Calculation can only lead you astray." If it was pointed out that there existed photographic evidence that the Milky Way was comprised of millions of stars, he responded that the pictures had been faked by "reactionary" astronomers. He responded in a similar way when it was pointed out that the surface temperature of the Moon had been measured in excess of 100 C in the daytime, writing to rocket expert Willy Ley: "Either you believe in me and learn, or you will be treated as the enemy."[7]

Astronomers generally dismissed his views and the following they acquired as a "carnival". Although Hörbiger's theories have much in common with those of Immanuel Velikovsky (parallels between the two were drawn by Martin Gardner in Chapter Three of his Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science), the scientific community had a much calmer reaction to Hörbiger's theories than to Velikovsky's, and his publisher was never boycotted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welteislehre

[MikeWB]

I finished watching  "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" and I have to say that I've never seen a movie so deliberately deceptive. The movie is full of lies and half-assed conclusions based on nonsense. I'm amazed that people here would fall for that.  It's a very skillfully made deception... it exceed the BS propaganda that Zios pipe down the airwaves daily.

I've learned a lot from watching that movie — a lot about how to make deceptive movies. I'd recommend everyone to watch it just to see how to make persuasive movies that are based on a lot of lies.

[veritasvincit]

they landed on the moon yet they didn't have the technology 40 years later to monitor, identify and prevent 2 planes from flying in air space into 2 of the largest buildings in one of the most sophisticated cities in the world?

hmmmm

[LordLindsey]

Mike, I think that you really should post what you find to be gross mis-conduct in "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon."  The footage showing the astronauts faking going half-way to the moon is real and I don't need to see anything else, except perhaps the facts regarding the Van Allen Radiation Belts--astronauts in shuttles today can not get near the Belts without the radiation being devastatingly powerful to them.

LINDSEY

[Ognir]

:lol:


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